In late 2005 I wondered how much each notch was costing me. Is my game saving me money over escort services? I decided to add a new line on my monthly budget called “Dating” and keep track of money I spent on dates. I added a separate line called “Nightlife” to account for drinking when I wasn’t in the company of a specific girl. This may hide the true cost of a notch since money spent meeting girls at venues such as bars add up, but my intent when I go out isn’t always to get laid (surprisingly).
My goal was to keep the CPN under $200. More than that and I’m heading into the hourly charge of escorts.
Because I had constant feedback on how much sex was costing me, I was able to always adjust in order to lower expenses. Midway through the year, to lower my CPN, I started doing more coffee dates and dinner dates where I would cook a meal from my Betty Crocker cookbook. Taking dates up to Baltimore also saved money. After all the sex was done and all expenses tabulated, my CPN for 2006 ended up to be $187. This number also accounts for those girls I went out on a date with but not did not eventually have sex with.
I have no idea if this number is too high or not because there are no benchmarks to compare it too, but the fact that I’m cheap as hell and try to get the bang as quickly as possible means it’s probably on the very low end for most guys my age in this area, especially when a significant percentage of guys seem to enjoy subsidizing a woman’s fine dining habit. I did not do a restaurant dinner date in 2006.
I strongly believe that sex with quality women can be had without spending money, so I am aiming for a 2007 CPN of $50. There is no reason that I should pay more for sex with a twenty-something woman past her physical prime when young guys in college are fucking tight-bodied coeds for practically nothing.
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) who are just the super-swellest folks to share a beach house with ever. My own private 1900 house feels a little bleaker without a jacuzzi on the roof. As a way of return, I offer some a random Baltimore slam (and I thank Wonkette for it.) From some blog
From my friend Roosh In late 2005 I wondered how much each notch was costing me. Is my game saving me money over escort services? I decided to add a new line on my monthly budget called “Dating” and keep track of money I spent on dates. I added a separate line called
owners theoretically could rake in several thousands of extra dollars per month. And if this were true, would this financial advantage be enough to outweigh the fear of being caught and the ethics involved in cheating loyal customers? Roosh investigated this principle of incentives yesterday by examining how much each sexual partner was costing him and considering whether an escort service was a more financially desirable choice. He found his $187 CPN (cost per notch) was less than an escort’s rates and, therefore,
No oversized genitalia in this rendering? I’m kind of disappointed.
Here’s your problem Roosh — you focus too much on money as your measure of success or failure. Your goal should be to get laid with as little effort as possible, not just how much of your hard-earned money you spend. You need to BE what attracts women, so that they’re the ones coming up to you. In other words, you ARE your game. I’m an advocate of gaming without having to play the game (yes, it’s a little bit of Taoism). Money, power and fame are the three avenues to effortless notches.
In regards to money, you’re not spending any money on her. Rather, it’s your material lifestyle which will attract women, and the potential that they will get to share that lifestyle with you. Power, they say, is the ultimate aphrodisiac. By occupying a position of power you attract women who wish to share in wielding that power. Fame is the ultimate in garnering the attention of massive numbers of people. Because many women are attention whores, they will want to share your limelight and obtain some of that massive attention for themselves.
In regards to money, power and fame, many women will give everything they are to share in yours. They will often do so before getting what they want, simply because they know that there are thousands of other women just like them who will if they won’t.
Stick figure drawings are excellent. A picture is worth a thousand words.
Aren’t you off the market? Nee’ the DC Bachelor?
Wow. Just wow. If you can pull off the $50 dollar goal, hats off to you. That is going to be tough. Also, thanks for making me feel (at a young 23) that I’m as desireable to men my age as a 45 year old divorcee. Jesus.
Asian massage parlors in DC will run you less than $160 including tip. But even if you’re willing to shell out thousands for the hottest blonde amazon in town, she’s still an escort. I’ve been to my share of hookers of varying quality and although I’ve had some good times, in the end she’s a hooker. Everything she says and does is fake and you don’t want to go down on her. There’s a lot to be said for the give and take you get nailing a real girl who’s into you, if only for that night.
You should send this article to the writers of Freakonomics. If you haven’t read the book, read check out the blog (http://freakonomics.com/blog/) and you’ll see why.
I would have never hooked up with a guy past 23 when I was in college…that was considered old.
We women may be getting older but so are you guys…women want young guys with tight bodies as well, not older,depressing men with sad, bitter views on women and the world who are approaching 30.
Apologies for taking the thread in a different direction…just making a point as to why male college students are banging hot female college students. Its bc they too are young, hot & tight as well and their sexual appetites are much more voracious than men who’s sexual appetites have already peaked at 22.
I personally don’t sweat the price because I do what I want to do on dates. Yes, I said “date.” If I want to eat at a nice restaurant (and I usually do!), or I want to watch a nice show, then I do it. I’m more concerned about having a good time then constantly trying to ascertain whether or not I’m being taken advantage of. And I don’t do it to impress them either. That is my reality, my world, so why should I change it up for them? That’s the last thing you want to do — not be yourself.
There is of course a limit to this — but I think that this is more a factor of the guy not leading/escalating moreso than the girl having malicious intent. And if I don’t feel a connection then we probably don’t go out anymore. I’m not trying to buy their love/sex.
Of course, I find nothing wrong with you being frugal with girls if that’s you. Although prostitutes = gross at any price. Seriously. How can you compare a girl that actually *wants* to have sex with you and one who actually does see you as dollar signs?
Wow – depressing. I am 29.
Men’s sexual appetites do not peak at 22. That’s an urban legend. According to actual doctors, it peaks at around 30. The feminist media keeps coming up with ways to shame men and render them metaphorically impotent, and “empower women.” The “sexual peak” is yet another in a long line of anti-male media myths, like the way abuse of women goes up on Superbowl Sunday.
The new thing the New York Times is trying to push to embolden women is the idea of “sensual grandmas” — women hitting their peak at around 60. Have fun with that, people.
You’re going down a dangerous path. I started thinking of dating in terms of cost/benefit a few years ago and then realized that 95% of dates aren’t worth it. Now I only date a couple of times a year. I’m 34/m btw… It’s probably better not to think in terms of money but that shit does get expensive after awhile.
Also this line of thinking is classic beta male. An alpha will simply earn more in order to satisfy his desires.
“How can you compare a girl that actually *wants* to have sex with you and one who actually does see you as dollar signs?”
If the first one is a bad lay, sometimes the one with a price tag might be preferable …
Your choosiness about looks is one thing that is probably keeping your costs up. A guy who’s willing to bang just about anything with a pulse can usually find ways to get laid cheaply.
“just making a point as to why male college students are banging hot female college students. Its bc they too are young, hot & tight as well and their sexual appetites are much more voracious than men who’s sexual appetites have already peaked at 22.”
Wake up and smell the cock, little girl. Co-eds are more likely to bang fellow male students because fellow male students are there and readily available. If old men like Brad Pitt, George Clooney, or even nasty-assed Jack Nicholson were readily available on campus, co-eds would line up in droves.
Back on-topic: there are plenty of ways to date cheaply. Free concerts, drinks-only dates, dessert dates, cooking at home, drinking at home, watching DVDs, going to the beach, picnics, barbecues, shopping, museums, friends’ house parties, or inviting her to “just hang out” are some cheap dates.
My most expensive “date” was $200 (did not get laid). My cheapest “date”, ironically a few dates later, was $7 (got laid).
I have to say that I agree that the numbers are skewed because you didn;t account for the “failed” dates. Also, seriously, date ugly chicks with low self esteem. Think of women like fractions, self-esteem over looks and you goal should be to date as small a number as possible. So for example, the best girl to date would be a 1/10. A banging girl with low body image. The worst girl to date would be a 10/1. Shoot for somewhere like 3/7.
I always try to get a woman to pay my way, but if that’s not your style, try the Fleshlight? to save on dating costs.
I can’t remember if you’ve already done this or not, but you should devise some sort of calculator that describes what makes a woman worthy of an expensive date.
Kind of like your comparison of American, Italian and Venezuelan women, only maybe you’d give more points if a girl has an accent, negative points if she is a big fan of Sex and the City, etc.
It wouldn’t necessarily be accurate, but I think it would be funny.
[...] Keep livin’ the dream, DC: “I strongly believe that sex with quality women can be had without spending money.” [Roosh V] [...]
RACHEL, WHAT ARE YOU?
fantastic. just fantastic.
“Men’s sexual appetites do not peak at 22. That’s an urban legend.” True. I’m pretty sure mine peaked at about 14. If you really think you’re as horny in your late 20s as you were as a high school freshman you might want to stay off the streets.
You can pull college girls in this town forever if you’re willing to maintain the proper attitude and hang out in the proper places. These two factors can easily outweigh getting some 19-year-old’s tits in your face. Oh, wait, no they can’t.
“True. I’m pretty sure mine peaked at about 14. If you really think you’re as horny in your late 20s as you were as a high school freshman you might want to stay off the streets.”
Personally, I’m actually much hornier at 28 than I was in college. I think, however, that this may have to do with sleeping more, not drinking all the time, and weightlifting regularly. All that is good for the testosterone levels.
a good way to get rid of that pesky long-term relationship is to, during an argument, say something to the effect, “I could just get a hooker instead – she won’t fight with me”.
not that i would know…
you need to start closing on the first date or at the bar.
My cost per lay averages out to $0.00. No need for dates, coke, no buying her drinks, nothing. Why? As mediocre as I look, I’m a sexy fuck. Why? Because I make them work for it and they all know who I am. In other words, if you don’t give a fuck, then they will.
Either that, or find a career woman who pays for herself. CPN = $0.
i once paid for an expensive dinner date with a girl who did not later fuck me.
save the shelling out for girls who are already servicing you and deserve the consideration.
jgatsby, the kinds of fame and money that would effortlessly attract hot babes to your side are out of reach for the vast majority of men. while those two things are surefire weapons in the arsenal of snapper-snatching, the amount of effort and luck needed to achieve them in sufficient quantities to sit back and relax as the pussy streams towards you is beyond the reach of most men. the good news is that masculine power comes in several flavors and with minimal relative investment in understanding male-female dynamics and adopting the right attitude a whole world of fornication will open up.
You are losing me with some of your recent posts dude.
I get what you are saying about keeping track of money and about not throwing your money away trying to get a girl into bed, but there is a line that you seem to be crossing here that I don’t think you crossed before. Is there really a difference for you between “dating” as a way of getting sex and paying a whore for sex? There is for me and it isn’t just related to cost.
I spend a large amount of money on my girlfriend and on things I did with women I have dated before. On many of those things I have no problem spending the money because it is for my enjoyment as well as theirs. It sounds like you don’t enjoy going out, eating food, or doing social things any more– all that matters to you is getting laid, and that is a little…one dimensional.
One edit to what I said before– I get what you are saying about a girl expecting the most expensive place in town on a first date. Personally, I find that offensive even if I have the money.
Okay, if all you’re really looking for is a notch, you really need to consider the time factor. Take your annual salary and develop an hourly rate. Now in addition to logging dollars directly spent, log your hours “hunting” to. And not just the hours GETTING into bed, but the hours spend dealing with the aftermath too. There are lots of intangibles here, such as hours (or fractional hours) spend hitting “ignore” on your phone when she calls. The split second it takes you to get the “I just threw up a bit in my mouth” look off your face when she looks at you from across the pillow and says, “What are you thinkin’?” Take the total number of hours/minutes invested (less the hour- or let’s face it, fraction thereof) time actually spend in bed) and multiply it by your hourly rate of earning potential (and god forbid she’s a clinger and sticks around beyond a cycle of consumer price index adjustments, you might need to adjust for inflation…)to get your TRUE CPN.*
Betting it’s going to be a heck of a lot more than a hooker. Even a really “good” hooker.
* be sure to reduce your overall cost by the fractional amount of time that you may or may not have actually enjoyed in the hunting/aftermath process. Assuming you actually do enjoy women.
[...] However this post made me snort with laughter. A man has added up all the costs of dates over a year compared it to the? the number of shags… do go and read it for yourself…brilliant. If rather worrying. [...]
If you shag one girl on more than one occasion, surely that brings down the average? Or is it strictly calculated on Cost per New Notch?
“to get your TRUE CPN.*”
not really. you’re assuming opportunity cost, but the assumption is based on a faulty premise that most dating takes place during times that would otherwise have been spent productively. this is usually not the case. most dates are arranged during off-the-clock times.
“If you shag one girl on more than one occasion, surely that brings down the average?”
this is getting into interesting territory. a lot depends on the quality of the girl. the longer a really hot girl is in the man’s orbit of fucking the more return he gets on his investment and the lower the opportunity cost of lost time chasing tail that would likely regress to the mean of inferior quality. the pleasure of repeatedly penetrating truly high quality pussy needs to be balanced against the excitement derived from sampling new goods of varying quality. if his average notch is only 1 or 2 points lower than the highest quality girl he has been with then the chase is worth the extra investment. if his average notch is 3 or more points lower than his best lay then he would be wiser to invest much into keeping that one hottie around as long as possible. the fact is, the hotter the woman, the better the sex will feel.
if the man’s game is really tight, eventually his girl will start to turn a profit for him. ironically, men who have reached this nirvana are often the biggest skirt chasers around.
Hilarious posting but I need a more detailed explanation. Your cost per notch was under $200, but does mean you were one and done with all of them? And if you’re going to compare this to bangin whores, shouldn’t you figure what your cost per banging is rather than cost per notch? I mean – you don’t sleep with whores to raise your notch count. You sleep with them to get your rocks off.
If your putting in close to $200 per notch and you are one and done, without reaping the benefits of more sex that costs considerably less, I think you need to rethink your economic model.
Interesting calculation. And completely fair to do.
KassyK is to a certain extent wrong however. There are guys in their late 20s or early 30s, and in fact even older, who are not bitter, who have “voracious” sexual appetite and who are true hardbodies. It’s just that with age they get fewer and farther between.
Still money, power and success attract women like sweet lemonade flies.
LondonGirl, I hardly think the fact that a girl is shagged twice or more will affect the average cost. I think only the cost for the first shag should be included – after that you’re not really paying for it any longer.
I agree with Days of broken arrows’ comment. Cmpletely true judging by what’s written in all magazines out there (pun intended).
As for sensual grandmas, well that’s an interesting concept. Perhaps they’re trying to reclaim women’s middle/old age as a sensual/sexual period rather than as it is now, a time in women’s life when their men are either sick, dying or dating some younger model. Not sure how successful this will be given that women and men typically find different characteristics attractive: men predominantly physical attributes, in order to ensure good offspring, and women predominantly money, power and fame, i.e. aspects of a man which are measurable to the woman in order to assess whether he’d be a good provider. Clearly evolution has not managed set a time limit to these desires, which, thus, exist through a human being’s entire life. Anyway im rambling
Thanks for reminding me why I generally date men over 30!
come to think of it, perhaps I should be keeping tabs on how much each of my hotties spends on me and apportion my sexual favors accordingly….but then again, if all women did that, you’d enter a free market competition situation, and probably could not keep to under 50/notch.
your CPN is still way too high – some dating tips in this free book should help you…
I think what is funniest (and not mentioned in the post) is that in order to calculate your CPN you must also have a column of notch counts to divide your dating a nightlife expenses.
I wonder how girls would feel if they knew they were entered in a spreadsheet.. ;-) Are you using an automated excel forumla to calculate the CPN or simply doing it by hand? ::laughs::
[...] Cost Per Notch [...]
[...] Cost Per Notch [...]
[...] Clubs are out. They’re just too pricey, even if you get in for free. With a basic vodka drink at $8 you’re looking at spending at [...]
[...] second date she jumped in his bed. I really think Talleyrand is looking to break RooshV’s cost per notch. Dick goes quiet for a little [...]
Haha love this metric, saw this in a book called ”
The Professional Bachelor”, that where you got the inspiration?
No I came up with it on my own.
“Criticism is fine, but be respectful.” Are you kidding me?
Writing this crap about how your sole purpose in dating women is getting laid and you talk about respect. Wow.
What’s even worse is that not one comment, including those from women, point out what a miserable, disengenious attitude this it toward other people and life in general.
For the sake of twentysomethings everywhere, I hope you deleted comments that didn’t support your CPN bullsh*t.
[...] the amount of girls I’ve gone on dates with and not fucked, my cost per notch is definitely higher than it’s ever been. I’m not quite sure where it’s at, but [...]
[...] course, I can’t complain to much. My Cost Per Notch is extremely low. At first I wondered if I should be going on more dates. Now I don’t think [...]
[...] notch (NSFW nudity edition) Jump to Comments I think it was Roosh who devised the metric of cost per notch. He says he tried to keep his CPN below $200, which I’ll take to be about £150 in real [...]