Is Night Game Really Dead In America?

In the golden area of modern pickup (around 2000-2005), a little night game was all you needed to consistently meet cute American girls in bars and clubs. It had its flaws, but just knowing how to approach with a little confidence and dancing skill would be enough to get laid. You wouldn’t have to use the internet and back then day game was nothing more than a niche for guys who didn’t drink. Flaking was a low level annoyance instead of a common outcome. You didn’t have to aim for a one-night stand because chances were reasonable that a girl would show up on a first date.

My one month experience in DC earlier this year clearly shows me how much night game has declined. Now I know many of you rightly counter that DC is not America, but it is a canary in the coal mine of where American culture is headed. Negative shifts seem to happen in DC first and then gradually spread out to most other metropolitan cities, and I’ll be surprised if the experience I’m about to describe is totally foreign to American men who have never stepped foot in DC. Here are some things I noticed:

  • Lopsided sex ratio that hover around 3 guys for every 1 girl. If you’re lucky, you’ll see brief flashes of 1.5 guys per girl.
  • Almost no top talent unless you go to the snobbiest clubs in town where table service or promoter connections are a requirement to get the attention of above-average talent.
  • Decreasing level of thirst in women because their option pipeline is near capacity.
  • Having to compete with a woman’s iPhone.
  • An increase in group size with the presence of beta orbiters who purchase drinks and thus lock in the girls for the night.
  • A hostility to “random” men who are not pre-screened via social circle or a swipe of destiny on Tinder.
  • An unreasonable expectation from girls on how perfect your conversation must be when approaching. If you don’t completely capture her attention within the first minute, you’re out.
  • An increase in women putting down men to elevate their egos. Women always rejected men, but now they are trying to emotionally hurt you with nasty attitudes and cheap insults, leading to sour interactions that kill your mood.
  • An increase in bartenders and staff cockblocking your attempt and actually competing directly with you for the few good-looking women present.
  • Lack of eye contact from women or even recognition that there are men in the vicinity.
  • Presence of desperate men cockblocking each other—even their own friends—just to receive a chance at having a conversation with an okay-looking woman.
  • Increase in seeing ugly hogs rejecting moderately good looking men.
  • Decreased ability of girls to have a normal conversation with a stranger without looking at her phone or friends for comfort.
  • Decreased ability for girls to handle a joke or non politically correct comment without getting angry or emotional.
  • Increase in girls being incredibly cheap in not wanting to buy their own drinks. They rather save $40 and be surrounded by orbiters they don’t want to have sex with than buy their own drinks and make themselves more accessible to men who they may have a sexual interest in.
  • Increase in amount of unattractive cougars past 30 who are aggressive in flirting with you and feel entitled to your cock.
  • Increase in attractive girls being protected by multiple layers of orbiters and female friends, preventing you from even attempting an approach.

My most positive night game interactions came when the girl was highly into my appearance or believed that I possessed some type of status. I did not have a case where I approached a girl, she was neutral, and then I was able to increase the attraction by being interesting, cocky, and so on (reminding me a bit of my time in Brazil). Girls are now judging you almost immediately and the game becomes about not screwing up when this initial attraction is present, but even when a girl judged me as attractive initially, her friends, emotional fragility, and smartphone were ready to sabotage the interaction.

This leads me to believe that unattractive guys should not waste their time in clubs. Guys who are shy or non-entertaining clowns will also not get anything. Everything I saw in my month suggests that you must be physically average or above average to play night game in DC (or have very low standards). In addition, you need to possess a high level of game to simply maintain that initial attraction (get ready for her to bombard you with an inordinate amount of silly tests throughout the interaction) and also have the logistical know-how to seal the deal. At the same time, you can possess all these positive traits and still perform very poorly in DC. There is now a bit of luck factor involved in pulling.

For the more average man, day game is still fruitful, but this will see a slight decline as women show hostility to non-approved men everywhere, not just in clubs. We now have to admit that “street harassment,” rape hysteria programming, and general feminist propaganda are having the effect of making American women more averse to meeting strange men. This reason, in addition to girls simply having difficulty in holding conversations with strangers due to technology co-dependence, will put day game in danger within the next ten years. You can have the best day game in the world, but how will you even be able to begin the connection process if women are losing the ability to converse with new people thanks to their slavish addiction to technology?

It used to be the case that if you weren’t getting results from night game, you were probably doing many things wrong. But now, even if you do everything right, the DC night environment is so stacked against you that it may take several nights out and dozens of hours just to meet a decent girl who ends up flaking on you in the end anyway. If you’re starting to learn game today in environments similar to DC, I just can’t advise doing so at night. Go to bars with your friends for fun, and do the occasional approach on a girl you like, but you should be focusing on doing a couple day approaches a day.

What happens with the internet should be interesting. You hear second-hand stories of guys killing it on Tinder, but not many first-hand accounts. Just like in clubs, you’ll have elite men doing extremely well, and then more average men spending untold hours optimizing, swiping, and copy-pasting just to bang the occasional 6.5. Since night game is so bad, more guys will be moving to the internet, though not to day game, since it’s significantly hard to approach girls alone without alcohol. The inevitable result is that a 5 online is now getting attention from guys rated 7 and up. Once a city beings to see a decline in night game, men will cockify the internet, making online pickup harder. Decline begets decline.





This is what you need today to do well at night (the more qualities you have the better):

  • Appearance that is not below average. Ugly guys already suffer, but soon they won’t be getting even scraps. We need to put them on an emergency Thailand expatriation plan or legalize prostitution so they don’t kill themselves (or others).
  • Perfect game. You will not be able to make a single mistake even if a girl is attracted to you, because several guys will be waiting in the wings. Good-looking guys didn’t need game in the past, but now they do.
  • Extensive social circle. Back in 2002, having a social circle didn’t provide huge benefits because attractive girls were more accessible in night venues, but we’re seeing a shift to where having a deep roster of friends and high status within that social group will be necessary to get access that was essentially “free” before.
  • A bulletproof niche. It used to be that a niche was having one favorite bar in the city that you would go to a couple times a week, but now you will need a sort of detailed recipe of localized status or fame that other men can’t easily reproduce and that provides you with at least 6 months of relatively easy sex before it busts or is copied by other men.

My outlook is highly negative because you have to understand I’m connecting a 2002 dot with a 2014 dot. The decline from those two points of time is nothing short of devastating. I was a 23-year-old kid back then with the lowest of game and the most horrible lines and retarded style but I received more positive reactions in DC than I got on my most recent trip, when my objective value is at its highest.

I was starkly reminded that in DC I’m scum, just another drop in the bucket of employed men, and I’d have to be a masochist to permanently accept the type of abuse I was given. I think back to my one week in Toronto, and maybe I’m applying revisionist memory, but I’m certain I got more positive reactions there. I can’t say I’m crying about this since my stay was only for one month, but as long as I value having good women in my life—and the ability to obtain one without killing myself—DC is nothing short of hell in North America for men.

Read Next: 15 Factors That Determine If A City Is Great For Men

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  • Ian

    Where are some good cities in EE that outshine Americunts and their toxicity?


    We truly live in a brave new world these days. The part about smartphones was especially correct, when girls go out at night just to sit in the corner of the club and text.

  • 41490_0

    I certainly have to agree with all your points here Roosh V, I’m 26 guy and from London and your points on how technology is having a devastating effect even here in the UK especially with women who grow up here its insane and is stopping women and men actually interacting with each other its very scary, meeting up has become like something so hard for people to do, even talking on the phone.

    I tried Tinder once / Never again its a waste of time.

    Once I asked a girl on Tinder out for a coffee she replied, “I don’t want drama” so going for a coffee now is drama? but whats even more fucked up is she was so concerned as to why I didn’t have an instragam account or why I didn’t like any of her photos.

    I mainly daygame now, night game is not my thing but, understanding these social dynamics has given me hope and the understanding. I have met women mainly from EU and worldwide countries and seen the difference, attitude, how they come across etc some still have the issues above you stated but its not as extreme.

    So much has changed in a decade and you wonder what things will be like in the next few fears, but understanding what I know and hopefully more men will provide hope and change.

    Albert Einstein — ‘I fear the day technology will surpass our human interaction. The world will have a generation of idiots.’

  • Conrad Stonebanks

    “I’ll be surprised if the experience I’m about to describe is totally foreign to American men who have never stepped foot in DC. Here are some things I noticed: [list] ”

    I recognize a lot of the things you describe in that list, and I’m not even American. In my opinion, these astute observations represent a general trend of the reality of the sexual market place in the entire anglosphere and the cities of western europe. Personally, I gave up night game entirely due to the abysmal return-on-investment.

  • byronicmate

    That Ultrabar picture is hilarious. 5 girls and one guy has three of them! I never pay attention to ratios when I’m out. I’ll have to look closer next time I’m there.


    Bars and clubs have always been a terrible way to get girls, except for one night stands. This is because the girls fundamentally don’t take themselves seriously at bars and nightclubs, and so of course they don’t take dudes seriously, either. The financial cost of clubbing is another major detriment.

    It’s crazy that there are many dudes who don’t know how to meet women outside of clubs and dating sites. I mean, they literally don’t know how to meet women. Look at this White Knight, flummoxed simply by the question, “Where do you meet girls?”

    So Day Game is better….but I agree with this article that modern women, raised
    on a steady diet of SJW moral hysteria and learned autism from their
    smartphone addiction, are now impatient even if you just strike up a
    conversation at a grocery store or coffee shop. It’s amazing the amount of Shit Testing and bullshit you have to deal with to get their attention, keep their attention, and prevent them from flaking. Amazing.

    I think there’s an even darker element to all of this: I strongly suspect that women are now fully comfortable living sexless lives. Some combination of lack of maternal desire, Prozac, martinis, and smartphones has made the modern white girl repulsed by the act of fucking. The sexual frequency rate of women has plummeted (even age adjusted), and so there’s got to be some reason for this.

  • TJ

    Damn, time to go to Iceland! I had coffee with a girl recently who carried an iPhone and an iPad. Both devices were buzzing with incoming messages. She couldn’t stop looking at them and genuinely apologized when I teased her about her addiction.

  • Nick

    Interesting video, that dude was more willing to confront a guy and risk a fight than actually talk to a girl. Though what Owen does works, I think its a prime example of “clown game” that Roosh has written about, I’ve got no patience for it.

    I don’t think that means that “good guy game” is the only alternative, but in the daytime you also have the option of being suave and masculine, with some humor for good measure. Being a clown in the day will blow you out, even a “good guy” coupled with a confident, cold approach will get results, more along the lines of cool girlfriends than quick lays, but thats better than what most men get.

  • J

    Had my first night out in awhile this weekend and was in a group of friends of a buddy I went out with. After some time I get introduced to the most attractive girl of the group who had her iPhone in her hand the majority of the night.

    She tries to shake my hand with the iPhone in her hand and I tell her, don’t worry about it I know you must be waiting for an important phone call. Boy did this piss her off. My buddy comes up to me later and says, she’s pissed at you and I tell him not only did she deserve it but who do you think she’ll be thinking about later.

    Another girl in this group later comes up to me and asks why I hold my beer down by my side. I tell her it’s more comfortable and relaxing than holding it up to my face like every other guy and makes you look more receptive to conversation which she thought about then agreed with. This birthday girl stuck around near me the rest of the night

  • MaleDefined

    This post makes me think about Taleb’s fat tail/barbell concept. Everything weighted at extreme ends, and nothing left in the middle.

  • David

    Yeah, Clown Game is simply unsustainable and not worth it, as Roosh has noted. Even if you can be hyper-funny and intriguing for one night, it just won’t last because it’s too exhausting.

    But that’s sort of the only way to get a woman’s attention nowadays. Like I said, most women are now completely satisfied to be sexless, childless, and single. All the stats bear this out, and this is why the white fertility and sexual frequency rates are abysmal.

    (Of course, porn doesn’t help matters, either.)

  • Nick

    I think you’re right about guys moving to the internet, rather than day game. I haven’t tried Tinder (not used in Warsaw) but online dating has been over saturated with dudes for years. A couple of years ago I did a little experiment on POF, I got some better photos, improved my profile based on reasonable advice I’d read and sent out about 100 messages over a couple of weeks. Out of these 10 replies, maybe 3-4 girls replied to my follow up, and one date with a 6.5. I didn’t sleep with the girl, but even if I did it would have been far worse ratio compared to day game. There are a lot of things one can do to improve their online dating/hookups, but if guys are serious about meeting top quality women, you’ve got to meet them in person, not through buffers like the internet.

  • JackBlack23

    I plan to move back to NYC in the fall so I’m interested to see if your analysis holds up there as well …

  • reaper23

    I find the sense of entitlement for “average” guys to be able to pull regularly from a competitive night scene to be very strange. life is competitive, why shouldn’t night time game scenarios be the same? tilt the playing field to your advantage. don’t go where the competition is going to be stiffer.

    lucky for me, i’m tall good looking in shape and have tight game. dc is like shooting fish in a barrel. i have perfect logistics, abs, 6 figure++ job, and a IDGAF attitude when out.

    the only one of these characteristics I didn’t have to work hard to create is my height.

    I never experience the girls on the phone, rudeness, bartenders cock blocking me or any of the items in the above list. in fact, once i have a place on lock down, the bartenders are always helping me by giving me good attention, heavy pours and status by being attentive. I made that happen by being a regular, being friendly, and tipping well.

    there are ways to cure almost every problem on the list in the post. it just takes being aware and proactive…and patient as it takes time to internalize all of that stuff.

  • Nick

    Sounds like you have it going on. Do you really think you’re getting the best “bang for your buck” in DC though? I haven’t seen DC’s night life, but I believe it when Roosh says that “top talent” is few and far between.

  • Nick

    Day game is still a viable option for guys who want to put in the work. I’ve met girls in the day in California who I know I wouldn’t have gotten traction with in a club. Women want masculine men, but they don’t get them, so club clowns are the next best thing (or their best social circle option).

  • GustavoMan

    Funny, I was just thinking back to 2003 when I was 21. Man, the club scene was the shit then. The only time you saw a woman’s cell phone is when she was dialing you for a number exchange, and the ratios were in favor of men. I tend to avoid clubs these days unless there’s a DJ I really want to see, but even the bars are becoming war zones. Just this Saturday I had to deal with a cockblock from a beta orbiter buying my prospect drinks AND the fucking bartender. For a 7 it’s fucking ridiculous. At this point I just go out to be social with my friends with no expectations to meet anyone. It’s simply not in the cards any more.

  • reaper23

    it is few and far between relative to miami or nyc or la. but it is here. it just isn’t sitting on a bar stool waiting to get picked up. thats the key point here, chicks in dc worth a shit do not have any reason whatsoever to go to a bar to find a dude.

    find them elsewhere.

    i literally just stand on the street corner near my house during the day on a sunday and meet 7’s and 8’s all day long. real 7’s and 8’s.
    hell i just took a yoga class where i was one dude with 25 other women age 22-40 most of whom were 6, 7 and several 8’s.

    wholefoods, yoga, gym, walking around where those places are located. this is the best place to meet women, even for me.

  • Ian

    What town do you have to endure this non-sense in?

    Roosh is right in 2000 my game was shit but cute 8s would be out and dtf-these dumb ass chicks Team Murica Bankster Global Police is producing now are 6s acting like a Penthouse Pet with an entitled, shitty attitude. Rome is burning.

  • Nick

    Ok, it sounded like you were meeting these women in clubs. I also prefer day over night.

  • reaper23

    no, I meet plenty of women at night too, i just prefer day game because there are more them.

    my advice was to guys who feel like they can’t compete at night

    i’ve found the best scenario at night is to just hang out on the street in front of a hot place. people are much more open to talking on the street than inside for some reason. easier to get to them as well.

    no, everything i said was about night game. i like it, i still use it. i go places where the women are wearing dresses and heels. its fun to be in a meat market like that.

    my larger point was that all the items on the list can be remedied with effort.

    i have experienced literally NONE of this rudeness i keep hearing about…it can’t just be because i am tall.

    if you put positive energy out to the world, you’ll get it back.

    when you put negative energy out to the world, you get that back.

  • Nick

    It’s good that you’re getting results, but I think there must be more than positive energy at work if you have experienced no rudeness from women. Maybe you’re underestimating your height/looks combined with your game and attitude. Either way, everyone gets rudely blown out at some point if they’re approaching regularly. If you can flesh out a repeatable program for guys based on your experience you’d have a lot of takers.

    Great advice about approaching girls outside of clubs at night, they are more receptive then.

  • reaper23

    my program for success is:

    lift regularly forever. for years.
    get stylish fitted clothing.
    be successful at work
    be successful at life
    do fun and interesting things
    dont drink / dont drink a lot
    have a good education
    be traveled
    be dominant in life and the bedroom
    be a leader

    and then, see a cute girl and just say “hi”
    just that simple. could i sell that? nope. its too hard.

  • gringo jingo

    Same trends going on in warsaw.much less eyefucks,rude or incredibly cold attitude.
    I understand that its a way to filter betas.but hey,they seem to treat alphas exactly the same.perhaps its a nature built in safeguard against overpopulation,ha.

    I think roosh weakness (and majority ofus) is that we actually give a damn fuck.dont giving a sht should scream from all our pores and hairs fellas!
    Instead we have legions of betas..,
    I Mean only when 90% of guys will practice complete indifference to pussy things may start to reverse.
    Bitch culture is the only logical answer to growing pussification.

  • Nick

    Good program, and you’re right, most guys will never follow through, how old are you?

  • C.Contrary

    Over the last few months I have lost the mini gut that I had been carrying throughout my 30s, making even my face look more symmetrical, angular, masculine, etc. So I’ve gone from about a 7 on the looks scale to an 8 – 8.5. My flake rate has decreased quite a lot as a result. So I know firsthand that Roosh is right: if you aren’t tall and muscular, with a handsome face, night game just isn’t worth it anymore–it’s much too inefficient. However, as Roosh also notes, game period is becoming more and more inefficient, and this will increase exponentially as technology continues to virtually replace the human mind.

    In order to get laid regularly, you absolutely most reach your genetic max in looks, as well as be cool and confident, and basically devoid of human feeling. Being smart, interesting, cultured, having $: these things are more and more obsolete. It’s all about what you look like and whether you are known. As an experiment, I have been pulling out my author page on ROK while out running night game (I do so when asked what I do for work); it’s worked pretty well so far, but understand, if I wasn’t 6’3 and jacked, with an attractive face, these vampires would simply give me impenetrable bitch shields.

  • reaper23

    38. and been game aware since 32.

  • Monument Man

    You tend to put a lot of importance on a mans looks when this is only marginal. If you have a lot of money or drugs or status from being a celeb from being an entertainment industry mogul you’ll probably do ok. But indeed being the strong and silent type wont get you anywhere unless you are in the aforementioned categories. Time to grab a gram of coke before you head to the clubs so you can whisper the magic words in her ear “wanna do a line of coke, baby?”

  • Tom Dane

    Ban this lying idiot

  • C.Contrary

    Note, too, the importance of location. The urban northeast–i.e., DC up to Boston–is the mecca of American cunthood, and I have found that night game is less miserable in the south and midwest. Women in Chicago, e.g., are more receptive on average than women in DC, NYC, or in my own hometown of Philly.

  • Steve

    This is tough. Poland, Romania and other EE countries are headed in this direction. The FSU is static, but tough as balls, more than America. High price, but high reward. In the West you pay a high price for shit.

  • reaper23

    I know you’re bitter, guy, but maybe you should just listen for a little bit? this is my registered name at the forum. want to check me out there and see the real life confirmations made by respected forum members?

  • reaper23

    you have to reach your max in all areas of life. which brings me back to my original point, why do average guys think they are entitled? life has always been competitive. it was only in the last century that pussy access became more widely available, and that was by design to create house bound serfs with wives and kids. you think 1,000 years ago average guys thought they were entitled to pussy? nope.

  • Monument Man

    You tell chicks that you write for ROK, which is one of the most controversial anti feminist, anti status quo, anti faggy liberal sites out there and the bitches don’t call the police on you? This helps your game?

  • C.Contrary

    Yes, you do have to reach your max in all areas of life. And of course no man, whether average or not, is entitled to pussy: what Roosh is saying is that it’s never been harder for guys to get pussy via night game. This is about the efficiency of effort in a certain context; it’s not about entitlement. I am 33, about the same age as Roosh, and I have experienced the decline of night game in just the same ways he has, and also in the urban northeast.

  • reaper23

    and you’ve also experienced the positive upside to not having a gut.

    night game is not dead in general. its dead for the average guy who has a gut, right?

    maybe i’m missing the key point here, but night game is as competitive scenario as there is, with most of the success based on appearances. why is it a surprise that as guys like you and me understand that in order to maximize success we have to maximize ourselves? and that those who don’t do that will fall farther and farther behind?

  • Myopia

    That part about being aloof during game? The aloofness should be real, and any man should be able to walk away and do without, when up against long odds. Have a real hobby, something, that consumes your free time. Game is a game, play something else.

  • C.Contrary

    I just flash my author page–chicks don’t read

    my stuff. Also, most of my articles don’t have to do with game. And when I meet the rare American chick who is worth more than a same night take down, I don’t mention that I write for ROK. Still, as offensive as ROK is to women, I suspect that this in itself would be a huge turn on to some, given the essential perversity and general backwardness of women. “A man calls women cunts and vampires? Mmm, how ballsy! That’s just the sort of wickedness I need in my twat tonight.” Thus runs the vile hamster’s train of thought, if only unconsciously.

  • Monument Man


    They guy claims he’s never experienced any rudeness. I highly doubt that.

  • GustavoMan


  • Dumb Sheeples

    Here’s the reason behind the “decline” socially engineered by our masters.


    Too many slaves, too many ordinary slaves to support and feed.

    You want to get laid with a 10?

    Call an escort and wear a rubber like you would with any regular bar girl .

    End of story.

  • C.Contrary

    Not dead–just more inefficient than ever, and this trend is not going to be reversed.

    I may be back to looking my best; that doesn’t mean I still don’t get flaked on a lot, or more than I did when I was an 8 to 8.5 before the smart phone and social media era.

    Today women come to the bar or club ALREADY sated on male attention. It wasn’t like that before smart phones and social media.

    And if there’s a very good looking guy out there who approaches in mass volume like I do, but says he never gets flaked on, he is BSing. There are countless reasons why women flake; many of them have nothing to do with your sexual market value. Flaking is often beyond a man’s control. Let’s be real here!

  • reaper23

    maybe my definition of rude is different than yours. do girls sometimes ignore me when i say hi? yes. do they sometimes give me a funny look when i say hi? yes. do they respond with something nasty or vitriolic? never.

    women have no obligation to respond to your overtures, ever. being ignored or rejected isn’t being rude, its them exercising their perfectly normal rights to talk to whoever they want.

    perhaps its your expectation that they owe you something that is the problem.

    hell, the rudest women i’ve encountered are the ugly ones that approach me. and they are rude because even after i tell them i’m not interested they persist. and then i get rude and tell them to fuck off.

    maybe you’re the ugly girl approaching me in this scenario?

  • rpg

    DC is a hell hole. Try Dallas. There is a sea of white that descends from the wealthy burbs on weekends.

  • reaper23

    what does “flake” mean to you? i think people use that word to mean all kinds of rejection.

    rarely, RARELY, does a woman ever cancel hard plans on me and never ever without sufficient notice.

    do women flake on soft plans? on plans like “are you going to be tonight? ok great, lets touch base later on in the evening” that shit happens a lot, but i set up three or four like that just to see what might happen, as back ups.

    but i dont consider that flaking. thats soft planning and if it works it works if it doesnt, it doesnt.

    but no chick just never shows up for a hard date

  • Monument Man

    Quote: “maybe my definition of rude is different than yours. do girls sometimes ignore me when i say hi? yes. do they sometimes give me a funny look when i say hi?…”

    Ok then maybe this is it – your definition of ‘rude’ is different from mine. What you just outlined (i quoted above) is what I and almost every self respecting man would define as rude female behavior. Its one thing to make an argument that no man may be entitled to sex, but every person should be entitled to common decency even at the most casual human interactions.

    So, in a nutshell friend, you indeed experience rude behavior from women. Be willing to at least acknowledge this so others won’t scream to have to banned; because your other advice is sound.

  • reaper23


    why the fuck are you entitled to a woman’s time and energy just because you said hello?

    look at it from the other way around. i get approached often. and 90% of the time i want nothing to do with the woman. so i smile and say hi and turn away. or just nod my head. or avoid them when they are getting close.

    its annoying. it bothers me.

    i have told a woman that she was sexually harassing me, get the fuck away from me.

    why do these bitches feel entitled to me time or energy?

    they aren’t.

    and that makes them rude.

    a girl not accepting your approach is a normal human right.

    the fact you think they owe you something is entirely your problem.

  • reaper23

    seriously, outline for me a cogent argument that shows you are “entitled” to another human being’s attention?

  • J.M.

    1000 years ago the average guy was likely a soldier or had been a soldier and in many instances his wife was part of the booty in some battle. Whether you like it or not most males didn’t reproduce in history, not because women rejected them but because many were killed in battle or by disease when they were younger.

  • Monument Man

    I was in fact agreeing with you on the topic of entitlement.

  • reaper23

    an alternative way of looking at that is to say that there were so many average guys with no bitches that wars were needed to keep them busy and to get them rape victims for reproduction.

    bottom line is that average never got you anywhere good.

  • Monument Man

    Go back and read again what i wrote then continue this conversation.

  • The_Emperor

    There is incongruency with the way girls dress, represent themselves as sluts in bars and clubs, and how do they behave (dismissive and snobbish to say the least). They are not there to meet men. They are there for free drinks and attention whoring. She already has fuck buddies for each day of the week. Watch
    Since it’s gonna be little time before day game is ruined too. Because the same snobbish slut that was in the bar Saturday night would be way open and friendly when you open her Sunday afternoon when she’s picking up her groceries. Can you follow up with ways to optimize your day game based on your recent stay in DC?

  • reaper23

    if i misunderstood you, then i apologize but what does this mean?:

    “Its one thing to make an argument that no man may be entitled to sex, but every person should be entitled to common decency even at the most casual human interactions”

    decency is appreciating another human’s right to not have to talk to you or expend one ounce of energy to you just because you chose to interrupt whatever it was they were doing.

  • Monument Man

    What I mean is it would be nice if a female rejected with politeness, nothing more.. If a guy persists after the first polite rejection then i think its ok she becomes more abrupt.

  • Conrad Stonebanks

    “lucky for me, i’m tall good looking in shape and have tight game. dc is like shooting fish in a barrel. i have perfect logistics, abs, 6 figure++ job, and a IDGAF attitude when out.”

    Oh look guys, it’s Brad Pitt!

  • reaper23

    is a smile and a turn away considered rude?

    but then again, why is even a lack of smile considered to be rude? approaching someone is basically an invasion of their world.

    i think a lot men miss the first “polite rejection” that takes the form of: a) studiously avoiding eye contact, b) turning away slightly, c) simply nodding and not responding

    persisting after that with even a hello is in the mind of the woman a “micro aggression” (hahaha just kidding, using that phrase is a joke. really. a joke).

    the whole reason i’m even debating this point is because i think there is a sense of entitlement being spread that is counter productive to game.

  • reaper23

    easy for you to dismiss what i wrote.

    if you’ll notice, every characteristic in my list are things i have had to work on, except my height. and that means i’m even taller than brad pitt. so watch out.

    point is, job, income, logistics, experiences, physical fitness, style….all can be improved.

    instead, its easier to dismiss me right?

  • Conrad Stonebanks

    “instead, its easier to dismiss me right?”

    I thought you just said you had a “I don’t give a fuck attitude”? This is contrary to you worrying about the possibility of people dismissing you (or rather your claims).

  • reaper23

    “when I go out”

    bro, are you satisfied with your game and sex life?

  • doclove

    Congratulations on being successful. Thankyou for the advice you posted above. It can be helpful to many men. I’m not being sarcastic. However, realize most men do not have what it takes to be as successful as you.

    Let’s look at height. I know that you had to work on everything except the height. Lack of height hurts men about 50-95% as lack of physical beauty hurts women in the Sexual market place of today. There is nothing any man can do about it at all.

    Let’s look at the rest of the list. Men can make dramatic improvements, but will it necessarily be enough. Not everyone has the ability no matter how hard they try. It’s like men thinking they are going to be the next Michael Jordan of Basketball, Yes, I acknowledge that you and Michael Jordan had to be both wise in your decision making process and put in much more effort than that in order to be successful. Both of you deserve to be commended for that. However, what happens to those who could not be so no matter how wise they are or how hard they tried and still had pitiful to no success?

    You may be better than Roosh at GAME, but Roosh is better than at least 95% of the men in this world.. Let’s do a hypothetical. Let’s say Not Time Traveler(NTT) Roosh starting to take the red pill at to practice GAME at Age 23 in 2002 had to do 100 approaches in the night club or any where else to get laid once. Let us also say that Time Traveler(TT) Roosh age 23 in 2014 has to do 200 approaches in order to get laid once with the same level of understanding the red pill mentality and level of GAME and is the same in every other respect as Not Time Traveler Roosh. Who do you think either would be Better at GAME if he kept trying forever, NTT Roosh or TT Roosh? Who would never learn GAME because he gave up or women would never allow him to be successful, NTT Roosh or TT Roosh? To ask all 3 of the questions I have in the 3 paragraphs I have written in my response to you is to answer them. Therefore, I side with Roosh.

  • Quantum Observer

    “Contrarian game” indeed. Kudos.

  • reaper23

    but what are you describing when you say “game”

    are you saying maximize your potential in all areas of life?

    if you’re maximized in all areas of your life and still not getting any respect from women in general, and not just 8+, then maybe yeah you have an argument.

    you have an argument for reducing expectations and understanding life is a hierarchy.

    thing is, i doubt you’ve really maximized your life potential.

    nothing, NOTHING is stopping you from improving:


    only your limiting beliefs are stopping you.

    get all those squared away and then tell me you can’t get laid at all.

  • kraut

    To roosh, 60 years ago GIs who went to europe had similar mentality like yours. Heres an excerpt from this site:

    “A quiet revolution
    is taking place in America. (…) It is an upheaval brought about by the
    contact of US soldiers with European women. (…) What happened to
    American men in Europe?
    The modesty and unpretentiousness of the average European woman, the
    thankfulness and devotion with which they repay the little that they
    receive but above all the happiness they bring as partners in love were
    the strong impressions that Americans brought home with them. It has
    been, above all, this `spiritual revelation,’ as Sergeant Thomas D.
    Crayton of Cincinnati wrote in a letter to the Army newspaper Stars and
    Stripes, that has nurtured this slowly but surely emerging men’s
    revolution. Whether justified or not, the American male believes himself
    to be `oppressed’ by American women, and he has found, in his image of
    the European woman, the banner of his rebellion.

    Eight out of ten returning American veterans, their fists clenched in
    anger, so to speak, eagerly await the moment in which they can show
    their women how a `real woman’ should behave and what sort of role they
    as men wish to play from now on.”

    “Frau von heute”, Austrian women’s magazine, 1947/18

  • Aurini

    I was thinking it was just Calgary – this city really is whorish for money – but maybe it’s something more fundamental than that…

    I seriously used to be an embarrassing dork, and I got laid regularly back in ’02, ’03.

  • ODriscoll

    I am relatively new to red pill and game, but I live in DC, and in my experience, social circle and day game are the only ways to get girls here. There are guys in these kickball leagues who seem to have 6’s lined up fairly easily. 7’s and 8’s a little more work, but the base layer of 6’s helps the dry spells. You have to get involved in kickball, softball, crossfit, or something where you get vetted by the group and become approved in these girls’ minds. Gone are the days when girls could vet a guy with just their brain alone.

    I don’t think the lone wolf out at the club stands a chance anymore. That is where these groups of friends go out, but they cling to their group. For a solo guy to come up to them, it takes considerable shit testing and cockblocking before girls will bang.

    I appreciate Roosh writing about DC’s scene because sometimes I do wonder how someone with more game experience would do here.

  • coolstorybro

    I’ve often wondered about the guys who already have it going on in DC who then get some game. I used to roll with the 29 year old version of the man you described yourself as and its interesting to hear another data point that describes what I used to see in person hanging out with this guy. Girls basically acting like beta dudes. The only problem is he and I’m assuming you probably do but will never admit to is under run your girl potential and fuck shit up for the rest of us. Sometimes you’re tired, lazy, not in a good mood, and you decided to fuck those 7’s and 8’s you talk about picking up. The problem is based on the way you describe yourself is that you are a DC male 9 or 10. This makes these bitches think they can get a man like yourself to commit so when I come rolling around later and hit on them as a 7.5 I get a whole boatload of shit because they remember the time you bonded them. Granted this happens everywhere but it’s happening to new extremes thanks to tinder etc. I’m sure you’ve “ordered in” before off tinder like my friend call it – basically just dropping your standards for a night in with some girl that you have to put 0 effort into. Congrats on winning at life bro but keep in mind it sounds like you’re shit would be rad whererver

  • reaper23

    definitely. i’ve fucked plenty of 7’s and you’re right, they get very attached.

    the point i think that is getting missed here is that i wasn’t always like this, i’ve had to work HARD to get to this point.

    let me tell you a little secret. i once was 270 and 35% bodyfat. i had low confidence. i was supplicating. yet i had expectations that i would be treated the way i dreamed i should be treated. i was afraid to go to the pool or to the beach. i hated summer because i couldn’t hide behind sweaters and jackets. i would sweat a lot. i drank too much. i smoked too much weed. but i was always professionally successful and 6’4. but did i have my choice in women? NOPE

    it wasn’t until after i discovered game and then specifically this notion of lifestyle game, did I reach acceptable success. and thats when i would bang 6’s and 7’s all the time with no problem.

    it wasn’t again until i went from 20% bf to 12% bf and really mastered my dominant attitude that the 8’s and sometimes 9’s became a steady thing. since that happened a few months ago, the bottom rungs of my rotation have gotten a lot higher.

    these days i wont take a woman out on the town unless she is (using Christian McQueen’s scale) movie premiere hot.

    the take out to the movie chicks are now stay at home chicks.

    and the watch a movie on netflix chicks just get no love.

    i’ve seen it from both sides guys, from fat and supplicating and from lean and dominant and i can tell you – the latter is a much better place to be. if i can do it, so can you.

  • Dman

    MM, if you think your definition of rude behavior exists only, or even predominantly in the US and in DC, you are mistaken I’m afraid. Try going up to some Russian girls in Moscow in a bar or a club and talk to them…you’ll get everything you describe as rude and more. The same is true for attractive women in many other countries *at night.*

    Put yourself in the place of a beautiful woman. You are getting hit on all the time, endlessly and relentlessly with all kinds of cheesy lines. Are you going to give every single person equal time to make their case and an opportunity to show your personality? You won’t because you will lack the emotional energy to do so.

    To me rude is when someone deliberately goes out of their way to insult you. What would you prefer, a woman being polite with you knowing she had absolutely no interest in banging you or having anything to do with you, or a woman who does a head turn or tells you she’s not interested? In the first case, a woman can waste 1-2 hours of your night, and it will come to nothing. In the second case, you can move on to someone who might actually be interested. I know which situation I prefer.

    DC is a tough town for sure, there is no argument about that. And the talent here is not as plentiful as NYC, which is to be expected. However, DC does have a large international population, which you can take advantage of with some work.

    BTW, I can confirm everything reaper23 is saying because I have seen it all happen with my own eyes. Calls for his banning are weak. You guys can’t believe someone can be that successful?

  • reaper23

    let me tell you a little secret. i once was 270 and 35% bodyfat. i had low confidence. i was supplicating. yet i had expectations that i would be treated the way i dreamed i should be treated. i was afraid to go to the pool or to the beach. i hated summer because i couldn’t hide behind sweaters and jackets. i would sweat a lot. i drank too much. i smoked too much weed. but i was always professionally successful and 6’4. but did i have my choice in women? NOPE

    it wasn’t until after i discovered game and then specifically this notion of lifestyle game, did I reach acceptable success. and thats when i would bang 6’s and 7’s all the time with no problem.

    it wasn’t again until i went from 20% bf to 12% bf and really mastered my dominant attitude that the 8’s and sometimes 9’s became a steady thing. since that happened a few months ago, the bottom rungs of my rotation have gotten a lot higher.

    these days i wont take a woman out on the town unless she is (using Christian McQueen’s scale) movie premiere hot.

    the take out to the movie chicks are now stay at home chicks.

    and the watch a movie on netflix chicks just get no love.

    i’ve seen it from both sides guys, from fat and supplicating and from lean and dominant and i can tell you – the latter is a much better place to be. if i can do it, so can you.

  • 530 Game

    How old are you man?
    What kind of training did you do to kill the fat?
    The as ent to 8s and 9s had to be brought about by experience with 6s first ormdomyou think a fat supplicator could go straight to 8s?

  • reaper23

    38. its taken me about 6 years all told to get here. re: the fat, dont eat. easy enough. and by that i mean low cal. not starvation. intermittent fasting all day until 3 or 4pm and then eat reasonable amounts of the “good food” ie. lean meats and veggies.

    and yes, the ascent from 6’s to 9’s had to be progressive for me because each new level brings challenges that can only be overcome by building on your prior successes and realizations.

  • F Man

    In your spirit of pragmatism and results oriented thinking-
    Where would you say are cities decent for game now in Europe?

  • A Karing Friend

    I just watched your new video. Has it escaped your notice that everything you accuse Tucker Max of doing, you have done to Mark Minter?

    1. You stole Mark’s comments from other blogs and republished them without Mark’s knowledge or permission.
    2. You wrote defamatory articles about Mark and encouraged others to follow suit to ruin his name causing him continued financial despair.
    3. You have never apologized for any of this.

    This is how karma works, my friend. When you begin making reparations, you may find your own life improving.

    Kate/A Karing Friend

  • PicsOrItDidn’tHappen

    Something tells me the self described playboy reaper23 isn’t all that.

  • Christopher Bear

    these clubs are bright! i need a new study on how dark clubs get results

  • Mjolnir2010

    Many American women were already bad back then.

  • Duder

    Girls aren’t sexless. Don’t kid yourself. Here in NYC even 4’s and 5’s have multiple lovers and I know numerous guys who are totally average solid dudes with good jobs who take care of themselves. And they are totally sexless.

  • Acehole

    Very true. What we are currently seeing (the war and hostility between the sexes) is a form of soft population control that has been going on for decades. Believe it or not, it was engineered this way by very, very smart people who have been tweaking it and reworking it ever since as conditions change . It is not some dopey conspiracy theory. It is real. Birth rates are plummeting in all the major industrialized nations. It’s working very much as planned, and the plans are constantly being reworked with the same goal in mind; less human beings in the industrialized West. They have essentially created a class war between men and women, and stoked the fire of all the hostility that comes with class warfare. Men and women are openly at odds with each other now in the West, and the declining birthrates are proof of this. More people live in the planet now than in any other time in human history, yet there is a very low replacement rate, particularly in the highly advanced nations, including Japan. Rational men understand there is a connection here.

    I don’t think these social engineers are all that evil either. They are actually somewhat humane in their methods. 80 years ago, genocide would have been used for population reduction. Now they use stifling radical feminism and other foul psychological control methods to achieve their goals. While the current climate is bad, it’s not nearly as bad as being ruthlessly and systematically murdered by the state. Although that is likely on the near horizon. Humanity hasn’t changed that much.

    All actions have consequences. The consequences of what we are seeing now have yet to be seen, but I doubt they will be positive. Expect war, slaughter, and a general worldwide bloodbath. That is how humanity historically has solved all of it’s problems.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    I think women are incredibly ‘thirsty’–for Alpha. It is a game they can’t win because in winner-take-all corruption they can’t compete. I think they dress to be ready for that rare shot at genuine alpha. The gini coefficient on male SMV is moving towards 1.0. Women want paid for sex now, but they are marriage garbage in an industrial divorce mill. Big Daddy is toxifying the economy. Part of a cycle analogous to lizard mating behaviors ( White belly lizards (monogamous patriarchs) should kill cultural interlopers ruthlessly and stop this madness, IMO. Maybe next time.

  • Rakesh

    The obvious conclusion here is that technological “progress” is overbearing and dehumanizing. We must give up undemocratic technologies and gadgets that benefit only the elites, robbing ordinary people of what means to be human.

  • Acehole

    Yes, up until 70 years ago, there were giant wars to quell the massive surplus of weak beta males. WW1 and WW2 definitely stand out as beta snuffing wars. Tens of millions of men died during these conflicts, most of whom were likely quite beta, given their willingness to go and die in foreign wars concocted by old politicians. Nothing is more beta than being pointlessly patriotic and dying for someone else’s cause.

    Don’t believe me? Read stories about the pussy paradise that Paris became after the conclusion of WW1. The male herd was SIGNIFICANTLY thinned, and the remaining men had quite the surplus of willing women to fuck.

    Historically, only about 40% of males reproduce. The rest are generally sexually obsolete. What we see now in the West, and even more glaring in China and India, is a MASSIVE surplus of worthless beta men. Without giant wars, the entire world becomes a fucking sausage fest.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    I think the plan is to first tank quality not quantity. Sheep can always be culled cheaply, easily, quickly. Sheeple/liberated women are pawn weapons to kill reproduction of quality rivals first.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    I think the unibomber was a bit insightful but miscalibrated. The tech is here to stay because it provides advantage. What we need are the team society members able to handle it. Evolution will cull the sheeple from citizenship before culling the technology from humanity, IMO.

  • Acehole

    That very well may be true, as the system does need an endless amount of worthless consumers in order to function. It is undeniable that the quality of young women has decreased markedly over the past few decades, particularly the past decade.

    Overweight, tatted up whores are in extreme abundance in the USA. They are absolutely ubiquitous. Despite what they think of themselves, their value is quite low to the average man.

    Much of classical Western culture is based on the appreciation of beauty. Beauty is being trashed out hard, and it is a type of psychological warfare being pushed on us.

  • al

    You’re better off meeting women through organized events through Meetup. Women are a lot more eager willing to talk with you. I enjoy board game nights and happy hr events at quieter bars.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    “Without giant wars, the entire world becomes a fucking sausage fest.” That plays right into the bankers hands, which is why I am against not only government welfare but any charity tracked in a database or on a spreadsheet. Indicidual accountability instead of cascading failure for others to bear. If noone thinks you are worth supporting from personal surplus, you ain’t. I hate communal balloon payments.

  • Monument Man

    “Appearance that is not below average. Ugly guys already suffer, but soon they won’t be getting even scraps. We need to put them on an emergency Thailand expatriation plan or legalize prostitution so they don’t kill themselves”

    The more I think about that remark the more I suspect that in due time (not much time) a guy could get thrown out of even the shittiest dives if some female patron doesn’t think he’s cool looking enough.

  • Huss

    I was out getting a drink with a friend after working late one night. I ordered 2 drinks next to 2 decently looking girls with one beta male orbiter. The one girl looks over at me so I initiate conversation. I said “man I love this beer, I’m (insert name) how are you tonight?” to the one girl. the first words out of her mouth in response to me were “why don’t you buy me one”……..

    I refuse to even try to spit game at a bar or at night anymore having frequent encounters like this one. There isn’t even some bullshit flirting that goes on as they try to weasel a drink out of you. It is absolutely absurd.

  • Acehole

    Again, all part of the plan. A dependent population of stupid weaklings is very easy to abuse and exploit. We are like human cattle.

    The elites are creating living organ banks to be used for their benefit farther down the line. When an old billionaire banker needs a kidney, there will always be a broke, bottom-feeding hipster who has one to give.

  • Acehole

    The future is truly shaping up to look like a bad science fiction movie.

  • F Hunt

    How does a man stay psychologically strong in this living hell of modern Western culture full of selfies, bitch shields, and other sick egotistical junk from these women?

  • Acehole

    If I had the answer to that question, I would be a millionaire.

    The harsh truth is that you must look to yourself for guidance and strength. The world has always been an unfair shithole in one way or another. I would argue that things are better for red pill men now than they have ever been. At least we are comfortable and safe, at least for now. You must embrace what is happening all around you and learn to adapt to it. At the very least you must accept it and move on. Embracing it is quite difficult to do. Taking the red pill and being aware of it is really the first step. Then you can make adjustments.

    I wish I had a better answer for you, but I do not. Continue bouncing ideas off of other red pill men. Learn from them. Support them, and they will support you. Keep your eyes open, and your nose to the wind. Know what is going on. Be aware of this bullshit. That is the first step. Then you can make the necessary adjustments to cope with bullshit environment, and possibly even thrive in it.

    Also, lower your expectations of women. Can’t emphasize that enough. If you are expecting them to be caring, nurturing, supportive beings in this type of hostile environment, you are setting yourself up for failure.

    LOWER YOUR EXPECTATIONS OF WOMEN, my friend. It will help tremendously.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    It could be an opportunity. A good response is: “Women buy ME beer.” with a condescending smirk. I probably would not return the favor is she did by me a beer. I think deep down women know they are bitches and they want a guy that can know it and still value them. I wear my primeval mask. It seems to be helping. I might figure this shit out yet.

  • Deebos

    Was hanging with a friend of mine the other day who carries her phone everywhere, literally in her hand. We got to talking about dating apps, she is to on POF, OKC, Match and one other I can’t remember. I asked her, How many messages do you get a day, she said around 30 or so. I said that’s alot, how do you keep up with them. She laughed and said no, about 30 from each, so around 120. She said she really only keeps up on POF and checks OKC, Match and the other app to weed out guys when she’s bored. I asked, okay so you get 30 new messages a day, what do you do then. She said, well i go through and delete the guys that are less than an 8. After that I check to see if they have a picture of their car and their own home, if they don’t have their own home I delete them. After that, I’ll message back with Hey, if they message me back something about I should’ve wrote more I delete them. After all this I have around 5-10 guys a week to choose to go on a date with. I’ll message them and tell them I expect to be taken to dinner, and afterwards they need to plan something fun and tell her what it is. Whoever comes up with the most fun idea gets the date that night. She’ll plan with around 5 guys and cancel with 4 and tell them another guy came up with a better idea. I shook my head and said, wait these guys put up with that? She said, without fail they all do and typically ask for another chance to take her out.This friend is on the 4-6 range, never married, no kids and is in college. She typically eats at the nicest restaurants in town, has a way more active weekend than I do and when bored on the date she’ll go on the okc or match to start putting other guys in the pipeline. I told her, No fucking way would I put up with that. And she looked at me and said, “That’s why you’re single”

  • Rakesh

    Never said to give up technology, only undemocratic technology that messes with healthy human behavior. Some technologies may provide advantages for some people, but most information era technology is nothing but trivial and useless, intended by its creators exclusively for social engineering, control and bleeding you out of your hard-earned money.

    Tell me, what are we losing from not owning smartphones and going out only with our wallets and keys ?

  • Mark

    Your friend probably only has sex with the best looking of the guys she meets. Those guys are having sex with multiple women. She’ll be part of their rotating harem but won’t care because she’s not looking for a long term relationship. If you are an average young guy on an internet dating site you aren’t going to be able to compete with these guys. The best you can hope for is to provide free meals and an ego boost to various females. Then when they reach their thirties these same women will suddenly start being friendly to you. You’ll look at their aging bodies, their kids with other men and think about how you’ve gotten to enjoy the freedom of your bachelor lifestyle. You’ll decide to not get involved with them and wonder to yourself why they wasted their youth and weren’t interested in you back when they had a chance with you.

  • anonymous

    There’s something to what he says though. There was a study recently that revealed that adults in the US are having 25% less sex than they were a decade ago. That is an absolutely gigantic change with quite frankly earth shattering implications.

  • CardinalMethod

    As a man who prefers good girls, I immediately begin with subconscious shaming tactics when I find out a girl enjoys drinking, much-less bar-hopping and clubbing. A great way to do this, is discretely bring up an ex-girlfriend, and her drinking problem was the cause of her deal-breaking vaginal aroma.

  • actionoftime

    So if the girls don’t get hitched cause their late and past their prime, and guys keep going after the same young girls but continually get rejected cause there not the best, then they don’t get hitched either. So how then does anyone get married nowadays or children?

  • preppin

    Whew. And I thought it was just me.

    I came late to the game around 2009 after splitting from the ex and fumbling with game 101. Even thought it was past the highs of night game in 2005 as you say, I sill did well. Now days, I can go weeks without even getting a number, not that a number even means anything. Granted, I don’t go out nearly as much, and I think I’ve worn out the local spots. But damn. It just has sucked for the last 18 months.

    I know some of it is my much more stringent standards and being older, I can easily go into a club or bar and see ZERO talent. Your cougars are my juniors in some cases. Yet, nothing is more attractive to an accomplished older gentleman than a fit and feminine 21 year old.

    But you’re right. There’s something going on that things are worse, much worse than a few years ago. I’ve gotta get back on the road back to Asia and EE.

  • SpecialEd

    “I was a 23-year-old kid back then with the lowest of game and the most horrible lines and retarded style but I received more positive reactions in DC than I got on my most recent trip, when my objective value is at its highest.”

    Time is cruel mistress, Roosh. Lol.

  • preppin

    Great find. Very telling. Fredeicks of Hollywood, the famous lingerie store, was founded by Fredrick Mellinger in 1947 after he interviewed returning GI’s to see what types of products they’d be inclined to purchase. The GI’s loved the lingerie FRENCH WOMEN wore on a regular basis. The rest is history. Including the decline and bankruptcy of Federicks as American women would rather burn bras than put on sexy lingerie for their men.

  • anonymous

    Are you open to the idea that you’ve been operating under a false premise this entire time? Occam’s Razor tells me that your value probably WAS higher at 23 than at 33, that the entire “men appreciate in value with age” meme is (almost) as false for men as it is for women, and that your game, beyond the courage it equips you with to actually start an interaction, is placebo at best, highly dubious at worse, and probably equivalent to the woman who thinks a corporate job gives her a better shot of landing a quality man. Just a thought.

  • Edward (Teddy) Bear

    In 2002, I too, was that kid in my early 20s (20 in fact) going to bars in the capital of another Anglosphere country. Back then, I could count on picking up girls, getting pulled in for make-out grinding sessions on the dancefloor, and the like, without much effort (and often at the girl’s initiative).

    In the last few years, there has been a dramatic reversal in the situation. The major impediment is the hardcore clustering of girls into impenetrable formations in the bar, surrounded by – yup – the orbiters, and packing smartphones to boot.

    You can still get action (I think so anyways) in the Anglosphere city bars, but you need to put in a hell of a lot more work, be exceedingly attractive, charismatic, and/or have a schtick (mine is green chinos). A wore them out a few nights ago and got opened by women left, right, and centre (“hey, nice pants.”) To which I say, “do you say that to all the guys?” OR “is that what passes for a pickup line these days?” and then on from there. Resulted in drunk blond with big tits grinding me and sloppy make out session (couldn’t close due to logistics/orbiters).

  • Model 1000

    While I can appreciate your position and actually do agree with it for the most part, permit me to say that I would still like to rightfully punch the upper-level bastards responsible for needlessly putting us through such hell in the first place. Was it really necessary for their “soft” population control method to also forcefully push so many clueless yet well-meaning chumps through the marriage-divorce industry meat grinder? Why not just generate the necessary level of animosity between the genders, leave it at that, and let time and nature take its rightful course? We really did not need to be fed such blatant lies about the true probability of stable long-term family life in the modern West that have been responsible for so much cognitive dissonance and mental illness along the way. Sure, facing the reality of an active population control agenda in a more overt and head-on fashion would have been quite unpleasant to say the least, but it would also have been notably more direct and painless, or so I think.

  • Edward (Teddy) Bear

    Yesh (that’s my drunk voice), you should have counterproposed that they procure you a beer. That would have been a better strategy than just ejecting. At least you might have got a pump and dump out of it.

  • Model 1000

    You have a good point. Seasoned generals and politicians are instinctively weary of other men who exhibit rebellious no-BS redpill qualities. Try to send them off as cannon fodder in some far-away land for your own personal gain and you are much more likely to be looking down at a coup and your very own deposition instead. Gather up an army of conscripted betas instead and you end up with a veritable set of life-sized toy soldiers to play with as you wish.

  • Edward (Teddy) Bear

    Given all the locales in the illustrious “Bang” canon, I presume Western Europe (Spain, France, Italy, Netherlands, Germany) is a big fat waste of time? I have been to Spain and Italy. Hot women but I was unable to operate. Greece seems like it might be a nice base of operations (favourable weather, compared to Buttfuck Oblast, and more amenities.)

  • Ian

    Dear Uncle Roosh

    Whats the point of saying DC sucks 1000x’s?

    You’re 100%right-it does.


    Where are some cities worth checking out in Europe?

    Can you confirm Hamburg, Prague, and Budapest are good?

  • seth datta

    Game has made men less interesting as it’s just a gimmick which all men now have, so it’s just a homogenised mass of guys doing the same thing. In addition, I have noticed in the uk, that even the guys who we’re doing well in the past, like band members, are struggling. Women expect more – perhaps it’s because we’re in the narcissistic generation, and the economy is bad so they are more open to a provider (that they’ll cheat on or dump anyways).

    One last important point. Demographics. There are more older people than younger in the west. And the younger people have been screwed over and are flat broke. You need money and dreams to make men motivated and women lubricated. I see more older folk out these days as they can afford to be out, whereas the younger generation are forced to live cheap. So I expect night game to die out as fewer and fewer people can afford to be out. Social groups provide access, but the new game (apart from niche) will be geared towards acting more and more homo, since that’s what the culture promotes. I wonder when we’ll see the next new innovation for pua, a man who boasts high lay stats because he can get laid by BOTH men and women.

  • Ruckus

    Elliot Rodger killings were a hoax, Roosh. You have dots in your club pics; surely you know how to connect them.

  • Ruckus

    Overpopulation my ass. If that was the goal and those in charge were decent human beings, you’d see gov’t policies incentivizing not having kids.

    The only way overpopulation plays into the grand scheme of things is by dumbing people down, effemenizing the males and creating chaos so that people are more easily led to slaughter (gunshot to the head) in the FEMA camps. They’ve already bought the ammunition necessary to do this.

  • seth datta

    It’s proven that Hollywood has satanic circles that use psychotherapists to induce slayings as sacrifices, so I guess it’s very possible this happened to Elliot. There are 22 year old virgins abounding in the world and not a single one of them killed for it – the media hijacked the issue as did others. He was manipulated and evidence was planted for sure.

    Still, it doesn’t change the fact that the dating scene in 2014 is abysmal, mainly due to older generations not looking out for the younger ones, the technocratic society and societal expectations. Men do not benefit.

  • Ruckus

    MGTOW, escorts, and easy opportunities. If not into escorts, learn to play on fetishes. Define the type of girl you’re the most into and pursue accordingly, and also learn to identify the type of women most likely to be into your “look” or vibe. Failing that, meditation or expatriation.

  • rofl

    “So how then does anyone get married nowadays or children?”


    America is a beta factory.

    There’s a teeming crowd of priapic, pre-cucked walking wallets waiting anxiously, fedoras in hand, at the carousel’s extra-wide exit turnstiles for a shot at their own vewy, vewy special pwincess.

    So what if she’s perimenopausal and herpetic? So what if she’s pulled more trains than switching yard tender? So what if she comes with $100,000 of undischargeable student loan debt on a $32,000/yr public relations assistant gig? So what if she’s already been knocked up by a drug dealing biker “loser.” (Her kid comes first. She doesn’t regret her past, only the people she spent time with. If you can’t handle her at her worst, you can’t handle her at her best. She’s ready to be serious and settle down now. Don’t bother messaging her if you just want to hook up…) So what if you won’t get any sex and end up emailing her a fucking spreadsheet documenting her frigidity like a ballless chump?

    That’s how it works.

    Coming soon: state subsidies for day care, so we can all better share in the privilege of paying for her mistakes. Isn’t that great?

  • seth datta

    I honestly think we are moving to an aesexual society, where women go their own way. The pill alters hormones, the societal expectations are excessive, and many women bang for status or resources that less and less men can provide. There is a massive pool of younger and older men all competing for a diminishing pool of young talent. People will have to work more I life to make cash and then work just as hard to date someone acceptable. Plus the women just want to play around until theyre used up and some omega will date them. It’s a social recipe for disaster.

    Women will just do other stuff. They have the state as their boyfriend and daddy. At least for now.

  • seth datta

    Don’t expect anything different abroad in the west. It’s a global problem. Ironically, actually being a unique and interesting and or fearsome man will give someone a niche. As well as a few other types of men. Since many of these niches cannot be replicated other than by a man who has been forced to live those kinds of lives, I expect dating choice will be extremely limited to men. We will see more japan type incels, even amongst men who we’re doing well previously. Even the women will get bored of all the choice – they’re more about getting attention.

  • Ruckus

    I think you forgot the link to your product. Lolz.

  • Ruckus

    You say life is competitive, but when it comes to gender issues you don’t see females squabbling when it comes to a female vs. male issue.

    You see guys squabbling all the time (top-pussy slaying dudes and white knights versus the rest of us).

    If guys put up a united front the way women do, feminism would not be an issue.

    You’re as bad as a white knight dude.

  • seth datta

    Margaret Sanger I believe from planned parenthood said in the 1940s that Europeans needed to have less kids. Hence feminism and the sexual revolution. This was before they came up with graphs about overpopulation and peak oil. Both of which,like the natural global warming, are false .

    I Read this somewhere, a real important book.It goes something along the lines of “and the men burned in their lusts for one another, and the women used themselves as was not in nature. For having forgot God, he left them to be taken over by a depraved mind”. Kind of apt as it was talking about the end of civilization and a return back to basics after much human suffering due to people behaving excessively in such ways.

    Older generation fucked us.

  • seth datta

    Leave. Live in a second or third world country that has a good range of women. There are some semi-westernised ones out there. They will be more resilient to change.

    I can’t believe people say to enjoy the decline. The decline was over the last two to three decades as the money and jobs were offshored. Instead, the reality is. ‘ prepare for hell on earth’.

  • seth datta

    How do you know things are better now? Things were better for our parents generation. Or in the distant past. Being safe is not a good thing. You are never safe btw. The safety has been traded for liberty. Being safe is not in masculine nature, which is why many men are so disaffected and lethargic today IMHO.

  • seth datta

    Escorts aren’t much use for men who seek companionship as well as sex. The easy lay thing depends on the guy doing it and the quality of the lay. The only option is to leave, which most men will not do. So rock, meet hard place.

    I’m definitely leaving. F¥¥¥ this fourth reich bullshit.

  • seth datta

    Best of the Gentiles must be killed?

  • Ternarydemon

    Such is not only a reflection of our cultural decline but pure, simple economics. When a female 7 has 100 guys per week to choose from, she must apply brutal shit-tests and filters to get down to 4-5 manageable prospects. You can’t message a hundred persons per day even if you wanted to. Even then, the top 4-5 guys get flaked all the time and must continuously invest in a numbers game until they get a bang. A female 9 has literally thousands of men to choose, and of course has even higher standards and filters.

    If I was a woman with such amunt of options, I would not care at all about one guy, and would consider the top men as a disposable, abundant resource, and the bottom 90% of men as asexual eunuchs who, at best, may provide me with resources in exchange for some of my time.

    To put it plainly, within the next decade, you will need to be an alpha with good game just for a chance to bang. The rest of guys will not get sex at all.

  • seth datta

    You’re right about the horror of technology being used against humanity,but I think you don’t know how far that goes! I know the best guys get made homeless – they’re not all drug a users btw. So the grade a of the human race never gets a chance to make a difference. Those of us left are the grade B. As for the looks thing, I am not physically handsome like yourself, but I a very different, if even weird. Just because of this I get enough attention from attractive women – I just have fewer opportunities due to having to work, study medicine, and due to having a long term sickness which I am recovering from. But my point being, I have noticed that many guys have worked on their looks, so sometimes I guess looking or acting different, without going full autistic or mysterys outfit a la the game; I guess that weird/different ness helps.

  • seth datta

    Is it about maxing out or opportunities? Because when guys don’t have opportunities, maxing out is the only thing left. And that is like a long shot. Change your environment to change your opportunities sounds better.

  • seth datta

    His strategy is different from yours. Mass approach with less investment on his part. Yours works better for your personality. Both are valid.

  • Solo

    Approaching 7+’s this happens all the time, I saw a guy last week, in a blazer, good looking buy 3 random women drinks it cost him $55. They gave him a good 5 minute conversation he then walked away with his dick in his hand.

    Last Saturday the first words out of a girls mouth was “What Kind of car do you drive?”

    not hey how you doing or whats your but what car you drive? wtf

    now a days when I go out I literally troll women usually words like “cocaine”, “blow jobs” and “gangbang” are used right away. You’d be surprised how many women actually stick around and ask

    “DO you really have coke or are you joking?”

  • DCwhiteboi

    Living in PG county which borders 70% of DC, mostly hood areas I have decent success especially since my taste for chocolate is insatiable. My game is all street game, in the car, on foot, at grocery stores, doctors office, nurse, gas stations, chicks in cars at red lights so on and so I never play clubs. Back in the late 90s we used to “parking lot pimp” catching them as they leave the club, that’s dead now. You just have to get in where you fit in. Stay ready so you don’t have to get ready she’s right there waiting for you! Certainly technology has made it more convenient for her to have her self esteem boost with however many likes she received on IG and really this is probably our biggest competition. Hey Roosh, DC is chocolate city, I never recall you commenting on black chicks, there are quite a few of value in my opinion, educated, decent families, cold whores, I’ll drop a bougie chick for a hood rat anytime! Have fun

  • seth datta

    They want to push you to the point where you’re so mad they don’t know If you’ll hit them or leave. That is what love is to women. They just want to feel at rush, like in the caveman days, when the man leaving meant she would be finished.

  • seth datta

    Get their number and send them a cock pic for laughs.

  • Solo

    Great post

    yeah I’m hitting the gym hard, have lost some weight but stuck at plateau. I know it’s the diet

    But Reaper is right my buddies who are fit are slaying poon left and right the sad part is they don’t need to put in half the work I do

  • seth datta

    So true. Centralisation of knowledge, tech or finances is prone to abuse by the wicked of the masses

  • Smart Alex

    Your assertion that women will somehow defy evolution and trend towards being attracted to men displaying “homo” attributes is pretty asinine. You’re either a complete idiot loser that has no game himself and therefore zero understanding of it, or a just a troll.

    A third option is you’re a closet homo yourself who considers himself an innovator of “bi” game and can’t wait to start ‘boasting” notches of how many cocks you’ve sucked.

    From this in concert with some of your other posts on this forum I’m going to guess that it’s all of the above.

  • seth datta

    The pill alters hormones as does stuff in the water. Only a minority of women are sluttier,most are just more debauched, not having more cock. There are less younger people to slut it up, and the younger gen are poor and cannot afford to slut it up as much. The Prozac and other stuff is right on the money for diminishing sex drive, as technology and societal expectations. The brainwashing for women to be aesexual corporate wage slaves is at an all time high.

  • Edward (Teddy) Bear

    We’re starting to figure out the script here.

    1. Police shows glamourize the police so that the population both fears and reveres them, keeping the masses in check. Do you revere the police? Recall that they aren’t altruistic good guys volunteering their spare time to keep you safe. They are the armed apparatus of the state designed to perserve order (protect the state, not you).

    2. Military and wars are fetishisized through the cloak of patriotism to ensure willing chumps to sign up to go through a meat grinder to help the state achieve material or political objectives.

    3. The working classes/blue collar/proletariat are lionized through the various sitcoms, etc., to perpetuate the myth that “hard work” on behalf of corporations is good for you.

    4. Finally, pro sports. The big distraction. Grown men worshipping erstwhile petty criminals running around chasing balls, corporate logos plastered everywhere, sitting for inordinate amounts of time dressed downing beers, decked out in balls caps/jerseys. Better they talk about Lebron than politics.

  • Deebos

    Bingo! This chick actually flakes on guys who she considers 8+ every week because of how many options she has. Its actually unreal, there is no way an average guy can compete. Her standards are ridiculous.

  • seth datta

    Ok they aren’t sexless. But that state of affairs can only continue for another 10 years as society is now geared for degeneracy. In another era, the girls would have to shape up. And I don’t count 4s as being acceptable women IMHO, especially when women in other countries are usually 5-6 minimum like in EE. A 4 is someone who is an abomination of humanity, barring some kind of physical deformity or major illness, in which case it’s ok.

  • seth datta

    Get out of the UK and live elsewhere if you can. You won’t regret it.

  • seth datta

    We’re already there!

  • seth datta

    Internet will be saturated soon. But for. Many guys it’s the only game they have. Day game, niche game and working at a lifestyle that makes you more unique as well as social circle – we’ll need all of them just to make ends meet.

  • seth datta

    The past was better for getting better looking women and better volume. But even then, most people behaved like degenerates. So I guess the society we see today is a result of that. I honestly believe that the best game will be outside anglosphere and Europe in the near future.

  • seth datta

    is the different trousers thing common? I was shocked when I returned to the uk after many years abroad and saw straight guys wearing pink trousers.

  • seth datta

    Seen too many older men with hotties. They leverage the cash they stole from the younger generation and they do social circle game.

  • pocketspock

    Spot on article, especially with regard to the night. Most of the guys that I talk to use the carpet bombing method of sending out messages on dating websites. This might work to pull in the odd mediocre chick for a quick shag but it has an awful impact on night game. There are women who are weak 5s who now think that they’re nines because they get doesn’t dozens of messages from dating websites a week. Approaching them in RL is no much harder because they’ve come to believe that the volume of messages is an indicator of their actual value.

  • seth datta

    Good girls are 0.1 percent of the population. when a guy says he met a good girl, I wonder if he can judge that or if he just got duped. This had nothing to do with your post, but your using the term good girls did get me thinking. I have only known one girl like that, if even that, in my entire life. If the good girl likes a bad boy or does things early on (that you may not be aware of) then she’s not really a good girl. The good girl is a marketing ploy to get men enslaved to their other half and to the social system of enslavement and debt.

  • CardinalMethod

    I agree, I think your estimate might even be high. That doesn’t mean you can’t play head games with them, in order to alter their behavior

  • seth datta

    Ha! But not so funny, could prove true in the near future. You can’t leave home because you’re a dissident/not cool enough/other random shit. So you are forced to stay at home like being in prison.

  • Chad Elkins

    I had the same experience. I’ve only lived here for three years now but I’ve noticed it deteriorating even in that short amount of time. Avoid River North bars and clubs like the plague.

  • seth datta

    Point noted. Lone wolf game is more or less dead, unless done in the day, with massive flaking to be expected even for the best.

    Only a handful can engineer scenarios where the rejection rate will be less and thus is key.

  • seth datta

    I see women with betas or sometimes omegas in the uk. It’s what they want at that specific moment/ luck of the draw. Even good looking guys find it tougher and tougher. Ironically, a genuinely unique guy will benefit in the long run, even though the society is becoming homogenised. Only thing is, you cannot copy such a person and reverse engineer it, so game matters less than fame, money, looks and uniqueness. And the most important thing is how sunflower feels at that particular moment.

  • seth datta

    And so the end begins…

  • seth datta

    I’ve seen environments where good looking status worthy guys were aplenty and they struck out regularly.

    It’s coming to a place near you soon…

  • Smart Alex

    Both great posts. Historical facts are always valuable when discussing these topics

  • Kizman

    haha man could you imagine what online dating would be like if society was reversed!

    Male seeking Female:

    “I’m looking for a woman who must be sexy as hell without makeup and make Kim Kardashian look like precious, have DD or bigger tits (Please No C-cups), flat stomach, big round ass I can sit my drinks on while I watch a game. Must not have kids, must not complain, must also wear lingerie 24/7 or walk around my house naked or dress up in whatever cosplay outfit I require to suite my taste. Must also know how to clean,cook “Well”, and handle her own sh*t without interrupting me while I play COD. She must be between the ages of 19-25 but if she 25-27 she
    must be supa bad because my cutoff is 27. You must also have supa bad friends and allow me to tap these supa bad friends of yours without complaint, and also on occasion join in. Must also offer 100% cooperation any anything I want to do. That means we watch the movies I want to see, go to events I want to go to, and eat where I’d like to eatbut since you must be a good cook that means at home. This request is open to all races of women that meet the above criteria I do not discriminate. Please only e-mail me if you meet my above demands”.

  • Ian

    OG Pimp Roosh
    Can we pre-order poosy paradise?

    I only want ebooks-screw s&h fees.

    Ill order today man. Your books are great.

  • Model 1000

    You in the UK right? Man I feel you. That place is downright scary. Not that it’s all sunshine and rainbows here where I live but I could definitely see someone from over there wishing to GTFO once they have tasted greener pastures abroad. How do those people even accept such social conditions in the first place?

  • Edward (Teddy) Bear

    It’s not common where I live. That’s why you can stand out. I wear pink chinos (nantucket reds) and shorts all the time in summer. Just don’t go overboard – wear a white or blue checked shirt with them. Makes the girls’ wet. They provide great openers. Hot girls on the street will open me when I wear these chinos. No joke.

  • Edward (Teddy) Bear

    About logistics, I think this is a very underrated factor. I live in the burbs (15-20 minutes to downtown) and it’s a hell of a lot harder convincing them to “stop in” for a drink when you’re such a distance away.

  • Edward (Teddy) Bear

    Admiral Cod had a great article entitled “Whoring at Wholefoods.” I heartily recommend it.

  • TyKo Steamboat

    I live in a resort town in Colorado & for 7 years & It’s been the same. The local chicks wear pajamas & have hair that looks like they all just fell out of a tree. They smoke cigarettes, lots of weed & chug PBR beer. The girl-to-guy ratio is about 5-to-1 & it ain’t good at all…But I carved a niche about 7 years ago…In these resort towns (Vail, Steamboat, Breck, Aspen ect.) we get a fresh crop of foreigners twice a year. Day game the grocery stores in June & get all the 21/22 y.o. Eastern European seasonal talent. Night game in December for all the fresh, seasonal South American talent. Be aggressive & hunt them early. Business booms for about 8 months out of the year. The knowledge of situation strategies is all the power.

  • Acehole

    Likely true. The West will look more and more like Japan with each passing day with regard to it’s male population. It already is. Lots of men simply checking out and going their own way. Many more exhibiting very strange herbivore behavior such as bronyism. The women in the West have massively overplayed their hand and assumed that no matter how low they drove their personal quality, that their demand would always be high. They were wrong. Men have their limits, even the sexually starved ones. Video games and porno are looking like better options than the average garbage Western woman. For the women, an army of cats, tons of junk food, and antidepressants appear to be the better option for them vs the average Western beta loser.

    The way things are shaping up, the future is going to look very, very strange. There will be many socially alienated people all over the place, most will be quite young. If history is our guide, it will only be a matter of time before the violence begins and spreads quickly.

  • JLundone

    You must remain emotionally detached and be a great actor to thrive in this society as a man.

  • Acehole

    I agree. We are quickly moving towards an androgynous society where the huge majority of people will be sexually obsolete and left out in the cold. Although, women are herd animals and will have a much more difficult time going their own way. Many will try, but it won’t be as easy for women as it is for men. Women crave status. Being a loner loser is very low status. This is a major blow to a woman. It’s not so bad for a man.

  • Acehole

    Guess who the state will force to pay for it? I don’t even need to say.

  • Acehole

    Spot on analysis. Humanity is wonderful, is it not?

  • Acehole

    No military draft, no societal pressure to get married, women give up sex on the first date for free. The list goes on and on.

    There are MANY benefits to living in the modern era.

  • Acehole

    As men, do we really need to be that emotionally engaged in the society? I think that may be your social programming talking.

    As a man, what do you need emotions for? You’re much better off learning to suppress them.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    A ballless chump just agrees to her terms of divorce. Women owe men sex, quality sex as wives. Society isn’t free, and they have nothing else to offer that will pull their weight. If we won’t call women out on that, we deserve every fucking shit thing we get. Otherwise, I agree with your comment.

  • Acehole

    We still have a ways to go my friend.

    I’m thinking the future will look like a combination of Terminator 2 and Minority Report, with a splash of 1984 in there for good measure.

    The future will not be flying cars and total human equality, it will be burning cities and severed human heads on sticks.

  • TheOverwatch

    Maybe you should just leave DC. Your posts recently have been negative and depressing. It has to be DC. Even George Bush called DC an ugly place in an interview. When it comes to American nightlife, location is everything. I’ve partied all over the US. You just have to get away from unfavorable conditions. No one living in Vegas complains about dead night game.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    Remember The Matrix movie? Sheeple don’t like it good and easy. They like it down and dirty.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    Downsize your sphere of concern. Mentally start as a nation of one and add concerns only as justified. Jews feed on Goyem, so feed on sheeple. Game is good.

  • TheOverwatch

    I couldn’t see myself living in the capital of the empire i.e Washington dc. Everyone is so hyper career oriented. It’s all about money, connections, who own what house in the Hamptons or Long Island. It’s a hyper aggressive city, after all it is the capital of this American behemoth. I’m not surprised the women are as aggressive and masculine as the men.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    Convenience is efficiency. Civilized people become more with convenience; uncivilized, less. There is no such think at undemocratic technology. Ownership or application is another matter. Proprietary tech is not bad per se. Sheeple are bad per se. There must be intellectual property rights for civilization to thrive. A free market of violence rather than the temple monopoly would do wonders for sheeples’ behaviors.

  • JLundone

    I never said a man needed emotions…I’m all for everything you say.

  • StochasticFats

    How can this occur? Are there really that more single men than single women in the short time period Roosh describes the decline occurring in? It doesn’t make sense from a statistical point of view, barring something like a Chinese One Child Policy I don’t see how the numbers have suddenly changed to favour women in terms of the single male to female ratio? I can understand the obesity epidemic being a factor in the West. This means that the few women that aren’t overweight have drastically better options than those that aren’t.

  • ons4everAlpha

    DC has absolutely gone down hill since 2011, but it will never be as bad as Toronto.

  • CaP7

    Perfect response to “what kind of car?” = …Which one? They never have a comeback for that. Works with job questions too.

  • Ternarydemon

    Her standards are mathematically correct in view of the available market. Hypergamy is a logical bitch.

  • anonymous

    Right. Money talks, bullshit walks.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    My respect for Owen just went substantially higher. I never doubted his Game, but the ease of mental insight is a real bitch to manage and maintain civilized values. That was fucking great what he did to that mentally diseased bully. +1 Nice comment link.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    I suspect you are wrong about Game. I still am tinkering with it, no closer, but I can now seriously connect (to the infrequent but regular chick receptive to primal connection in the moment) and my withdraw invokes disappointment that women show on their faces like emotionally hurt little kids. We men like a certain kind of pain with our sexual pleasure. I think women are the same with emotional neediness. I have blogged about my recent Game research. Yes, the social circumstances suck, and life ain’t easy. No panacea. However, if one can close sex, one can close a good job or income I would guess.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    Repulsive fat chicks stay home: could be.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    As a follow up, finndistan wrote a post I just read called “Game or die”. It expresses an apparent truth I am discovering. You must prick her emotions or she has no attraction. Her notch count, relationship status, etc. don’t matter to the lizard.

  • Sleigh

    God I remember the Ultra Bar. Sausage fest indeed.

    Lots of agreement as to how bad things suck. But there needs to be a counter to all of this. Otherwise, we’ll just keep going in circles about how these women suck. It starts with one person at a time.

    I know it’s tough with things being so politically correct and the feminist agenda is strong today. Speaking out could cost your careers and your reputation. I wish I could come up with something better than just outright boycotting these women.

    Good luck.

  • rofl

    No American woman is obligated to provide sex in marriage. Look up “marital rape.”

    Furthermore, your consent to divorce is immaterial, the terms are set for you by family court on pain of contempt of court and various painful civil remedies. The best you can do is lawyer up and work towards a favorable settlement.

    Marry in the US and you do form a very old school union with Uncle Sam, however. He can bend you over and penetrate you whenever your precious princess wills it.

    Marriage is gay. If you get married, you deserve everything you get.

  • Quintus Curtius

    “Cockify the internet.” Classic. Just classic.

  • Quintus Curtius

    Devastatingly accurate, and matches my own experiences.

  • nek

    “They are the armed apparatus of the state designed to preserve order (protect the state, not you)” This, almost verbatim, was what I was told by the cop teaching a concealed carry course (i.e. it’s your job to protect yourself, no the police, they’re “law enforcement”, not “serve and protect)

  • seth datta

    Moron. If you had anything real to say you wouldn’t get your panties in a twist yo give me a three paragraph response. You’re just projecting your insecurities.

  • Troy Francis

    Much of this is true in London too, particularly cockblocking by ugly friends and smartphones.

  • JackBlack23

    “Attention is currency in girl world.”

  • Driver

    Agree. A woman is only going to ‘say’ what is socially acceptable. Now, what she really wants (action) is totally different. An example (for everyone to see) is displayed on every woman’s online dating profile.

    She never states in her profile that she is looking for a guy with a bit of asshole in him to just take her (sex)…it’s always this fluffy, fluffy, nicey, stuff (lol).

    This is the very reason why you don’t take dating advice from a woman, period.

  • Driver

    “why don’t you buy me one”…..sure

    But, first, a blow job in the parking lot.

    Hey, a favor or a favor….all business (lol).

  • Driver

    Yep, I’ll confirm Wholefoods as a spot for meetings and pickups. That place has plenty of women coming and going…plus you can discuss different products (to try, likes, dislikes). Works like a charm.

  • Paso Robles

    It’s hard not to be a misanthrope at times. So much bull shit out here-‘it’s disgusting. The US can’t even provide good produce to its own people- the elite Jews would rather kill everyone with gmos- sick ass people.

  • Rat Race

    That’s an interesting excerpt. Thanks for posting it.

  • Rat Race

    “Many American women were already bad back then.”

    Thats the impression I’m getting the more I read about America back then. The difference between then and now is threefold:

    1. All and any social restrictions placed on women have been removed,.

    2. the major of legal restrictions on women have been removed

    3. Government both federal and state seek to control and oppress men via feminist laws and laws similar.

    Points 1,2 and 3 were not part of the zeitgeist of america back then. So indeed women during that time in the past were bad, but now it’s becoming painfully obvious that their attitudes and behavior have become up-amped in the name of tyranny.

  • Rat Race

    “same thing. In addition, I have noticed in the uk, that even the guys who we’re doing well in the past, like band members, are struggling. Women expect more – perhaps it’s because we’re in the narcissistic generation, and the economy is bad so they are more open to a provider (that they’ll cheat on or dump anyways)”

    Those are interesting observations made Seth. But I have to respectfully disagree about being homo to get with chicks. Do you mean to say “beta” rather than homo? Because in the final analysis, women are attracted to masculine alpha behaviors even though they say they like girly men.

  • Rat Race

    “The way things are shaping up, the future is going to look very, very strange. There will be many socially alienated people all over the place, most will be quite young. If history is our guide, it will only be a matter of time before the violence begins and spreads quickly.”

    With each passing year I find that not having children was indeed the best decision I ever made.

  • Solo

    A lot of this is true where I’m from in Minneapolis and one of the main culprits of this is gentrification(Minneapolis is the number 1 city rising in this category in the states). While this may be great for property owners and such. Most of the new clubs/bars all aim to be these Vegas style clubs or Lounges. When Minneapolis is still relatively a small city compared to most. Everything Roosh mention’s is happening/ or already has happened. I learned here real quickly as a minority you better have a “Niche” or “Social Circle game”. This is why my emphasis have been on both. Sure I could cold approach but after 6 years in the game and thousands of approaches you learn a thing or two about “Target acquisitions” and which girls you can or can’t pull. If you’re not extremely fit (which I’m working on) or handsome then cold approaching at night is a waste of time unless you’re trying to fuck bitches that look like Jabba the Hut.

    –I see good looking men buy random women drinks just to walk away without even much of a number. 6 years ago women where the one buying good looking men drinks(i’m dead serious)!!!

    –I see women baiting men into fights with their bitchy behavior because they know they can get a man kicked out. And these whiteknight bouncers will do anything.

    It’s not impossible to pull but it’s a heck of a lot harder then it was when I first started back 6 years ago.

  • Solo

    I like that one will use that in the future

    what about “what do you do for a job?”

    I usually say I work for the football team, believe it or not one of my buddies actually pretended to be a NFL player and it got him laid once. ha ha ha stupid broads I tell ya

  • Solo

    ACTUALLY THE OPPOSITE game is more important then ever. Because now women need more stimulation. The key is balance, and being able to show value with your best attributes.

    lol at this rubbish about “Homo Pua’s” ha I got a good chuckle out of that but you obviously aren’t hitting the field with saying nonsense like that

  • didiflex

    the same thing has already happened in Australia, clubs are sausage fests and ratio 3 men to 1 female is very normal.
    It was much easier to pick up back in late 90s and early 2000s. What I have seen in Melbourne over the past 5 years is emergence of 24/7 brothels and gyms, massage parlours are popping up like mushrooms all over the place.

    Its sad to drive past 24/7 gym on friday night and see guys lifting weights instead of going out picking up, they are hoping that things will happen in the future once they get those muscles girls will be all over them,in reality they ll be lucky to get overweight slut.

    too many good looking guys are competing, it must feel good to be a woman in the west

  • Alternative ways

    “To put it plainly, within the next decade, you will need to be an alpha with good game just for a chance to bang. The rest of guys will not get sex at all.”


    Hire an escort.
    Conduct model “casting” sessions to meet them.
    Rent out a room in your house.

    Don’t play fair and you will get pussy.

  • Future

    In the future we will bang sex robots with virtual reality headsets and silicone bodies.

    Actually it might be better than a real girl.

  • Dumb Sheeples

    ” How does a man stay psychologically strong in this living hell of modern Western culture full of selfies, bitch shields, and other sick egotistical junk from these women? ”

    Since modern women are not traditional anymore, men need to think outside the box and create their own new rules.

    Flash the girl some money indirectly. Tell her you are inheriting a fortune, are partner in a law firm, casting director for a movie, model photographer, advertise a cheap room to rent out of your house to get her there.

    Get her interested in what you can offer her and bang that pussy after you get her drunk off cheap liquor at your place.

    Once she realizes it was a hoax you’re off to the next one…. Get the system going and bang away a new girl every month.

  • Dumb

    You are such a dumbass.

    In your comment you disagree then agree with me.

  • odbo

    Pick-up art was a “solution” given to men by the same group who made women dysfunctional in the first place. Problem-Reaction-Solution. Who needs enemies when you’ve got friends like this. It is essentially men hitting the self-destruct button on their masculinity and their soul by pandering to dysfunctional, Hollywood indoctrinated women.

    Again, people, it’s not rocket science. 95% of everything going wrong in the world has a common origin, the self-proclaimed chosen people. Manipulating those who suspect nothing is very easy. That’s the only way Jews work, they thrive on ignorance and indifference and when the situation changes their only fall back is complete denial. It greatly helps of course that they educated the goyim with rewritten history which makes themselves the perpetual victim, it creates cognitive dissonance.

    Do you think black or Puerto Rican guys invented PUA? We’re talking about 75 IQ morons raised by single moms here. They don’t know manhood. They watch MTV. Monkey see monkey do. PUA has the effect of making other races more “Jewish”. It pushes disingenuous behaviour which destroys one’s character and devalues women as simple sex objects while at the same time putting them on a pedestal to emasculate men.

  • Ian

    Your towns known for stacked blondes.

    Where are some day and night venues youve seen an abundance of them?

  • Huss

    I try to not give any attention to these women. they need to know that that behavior will not get rewarded with even conversation. I started laughing at her and asked her “why she would think I would buy her a beer”. then went over to a group of 3 girls my friend started talking to. I ended up pulling a small blonde home for the night while watching my friend get to drunk and strike out with her two friends haha.

  • Samseau

    Yes, I think it’s becoming obvious that increasing the amount of men with Game isn’t going to make things better for men. Women simply raise their standards – having Game is now a requirement.

    As for the homo shit, I doubt women will ever care.

  • 20th Level

    I use what I like to call “brute force” game. I have to be as “awesome” as possible. Nice clothes, nice car, look good and in shape. Nothing subtle and everything direct. Act like you are Enrique Iglesias who just walked in from his private jet in the parking lot and chose HER not the other way around where she chose you.

    Make her subconcious think “this guy has some fucking stones. He must be high value.” Proceed to paint a picture of your awsome life and how you and your friends are always doing awesome things and you would like to invite her into your world because she would fit in perfectly. I never use any social media ever and the only thing she knows about me is what I tell her.

    This technique gets me quality numbers like its nothing. But of course as always it takes a sustained effort with the right combo of logistcs and luck to close the same night.

  • Ternarydemon

    Actually, in many primitive societies, men and women live apart and only get together for ceremonies, festivals and sex. In the modern dating world, real men and women have few things to offer themselves other than sex.

  • 41490_0

    I would like to but its easier said than done, plus not everyone has the options to move out of your home country, sometimes its just not that viable for now London isn’t so bad there is an influx of europeans and many other women who come here from different countrys and interesting backgrounds, I just keep on building my value and game and dating those types of women who are welcoming and dont come across as princess primadonna :D. But visiting other countrys and testing those waters is something I’m going to look into.

  • 41490_0

    I think there’s an even darker element to all of this: I strongly suspect that women are now fully comfortable living sexless lives. Some combination of lack of maternal desire, Prozac, martinis, and smartphones has made the modern white girl repulsed by the act of fucking. The sexual frequency rate of women has plummeted (even age adjusted), and so there’s got to besome reason for this.

    Female celibacy clubs is the main reason I didn’t even realise these existed until I read about this OMG! It makes a whole lot of sense and it even gets worse as you have solo celibacy too.

    Extract from the link:

    Have you ever been in a crowded bar, a social place, full of noise and crammed with men and women all there with the express purpose of meeting each other yet observed a pair of girls, perhaps sitting at a small table, intensely locked in conversation with each other in their own little bubble. Perhaps you even opened them and were told briskly “they are not there to meet men”.

    Have you ever known a girl, in her late twenties and single, who starts to get more into her career. Perhaps she starts ‘working all hours’. She may get a dog and/or even move out of the city into a small town. ‘It’s the only place I can afford the mortgage!’ she’ll say. She’ll get into baking.

    Perhaps you knew a girl who didn’t go to bars and didn’t get into her career, but she had a very close group of female friends and they did everything together, organizing character building activities each weekend and staying in close contact over social media. Most of them were single. They all went to Ascot and got tipsy on Champagne.

    Or maybe you were out walking one day and noticed a girl wandering on her own through the park, dressed a little alternatively and taking endless same-ey photographs with a huge SLR camera. Maybe you even thought it was a perfect daygame set and opened her, to be shocked at how disinterested, flat and drained she seemed.

    Congratulations, you have encountered a phenomena increasingly common in the feminist women’s desperate attempts to ruin their own lives: the Celibacy Club.

  • Anon

    Those club pictures and the overall hypothesis are interesting, but it doesn’t add up. Everything described is basically supply and demand economics – less women and more men at these clubs. Of course the women will be more choosy and shot down more men if they have their pick. This has nothing to do with night game dying out. The better question is where are all the women now? Last I checked with the census, the ratio is still about the same and I doubt women suddenly got uglier the last ten years. American women just aren’t in clubs anymore, in DC at least, is what the author is really saying. I live in LA and we have a crap ton of hot women and they are still in our clubs, on our streets, in our college classes, and at our places of work. Unless DC is a starting trend where women stay at home and go to all female classes together, I don’t think this article is as relevant as the writer wants it to be.

  • Altair

    I’d like to hear what DC is currently like from Virgle Kent

    He’s been gaming there regularly the last few years

  • J Play

    Roosh and readers-
    A better question instead of have guys in their 30s seen diminishing returns in night game would be are young (18-25 ) decent looking, fit, with some income, and social skills still seeing a lot of bs from the girls when they’re out at night?

    Younger readers please let us know how the girls are, what city you game in, and how is it overall?

  • lauraleewalker

    Whereas a lot of men may go to clubs to pickup, I propose that most women don’t go to with the primary goal of picking up hot men.

    They may go to drink (that’s why many women like it when men buy them drinks), have fun (some women – and men too – have more fun after a few drinks!), flirt, find men to date or have a relationship with, dance or just go to first base with.

    If that wasn’t the case, most women would be approaching you in the hopes of scoring.

    Many women are highly skilled at weeding out the men that just want to get laid, perhaps that’s especially the case in DC because of their experiences with other men that just wanted to get laid. Poet justice perhaps?

    You could say they want to emotionally hurt you, ignore you in favour of their phone, that their goal is to put you down and insult you, that they have trouble holding a conversation, are emotionally fragile, in other words: drama, drama, drama. No need to take it personal.

    Put simply: You have different goals. Women might be going to a club with a different end goal in mind, and they may be particularly skilled (like in DC) at obtaining their goals.

  • David

    nobody cares, dried hag

  • lauraleewalker

    You seem to: otherwise, why reply? By calling me a dried hag, does that mean you don’t want to think critically about the issue?

  • DeCode

    Hmmm, sounds like Korea! And no matter what you hear – the majority if girls worth having (7-9+) DO NOT care for forigen men.

    Social circle and status plus a willingness to spend stupid amounts of money reign supreme. And the girls are completely adverse to talking to anyone Outside thier circle – never mind strange men. Plus it’s hands down the most sexually conservative of Asian cultures. Even the hookers suck.

  • Jeremy Rose

    We just want you to leave. At the risk of being banned we are kindly asking you to quit commenting on this site. Women are not allowed here and your opinion is not wanted.

  • lauraleewalker

    Okay, I will respect that. I know that is the case on ROK, but I didn’t see a similar ban in the About section of your website. I understand if that is the policy on here.

  • Solo

    Uptown/U Of M

    But beware if you’re a minority daygameing white women will get you kicked out campus

  • Sam T

    Wow I haven’t been out in the clubs that much lately but this really sounds bad. I remember back in the late 1997s or so in California the bar-tenders and club owners would actually try and help the guys get laid with stuff like offering ladies drinks free until 11:00pm.
    DJs would play sexually provocative music like Sex by Berlin and would actually hook people up and encourage women to find a guy to get hot with on the dance floor. The ratio was around 1.5 Female to male and a 50% chance of hooking up for the average guy.
    I guess things have changed but the world is full of passionate women and My opinion is we American men don’t really need to fish in a dead lake. I for one have a passport, a job, and no fear of flying so Asia, Latin America, Africa, Eastern Europe? Here I come. :)

  • 23younggun

    was just in Portsmouth, NH and tried to night game with no score. Seriously the most annoying women I’ve ever been around. So loud and always on their defense. I’m back in the Midwest now and feel my SMV back up to where it should be. Fuck New England.

  • Farah

    Roosh, You mentioned that you are connecting the dots from 2002 and 2014. One thing that you are leaving out of the picture is the effects on social behavior in men and women as a result of the events on September 11th. of 2001.
    I have heard that the United States experienced a significant spike in child births during the months of June through October of 2002 that continued and slowly tapered off to normal levels all the way to 2004.
    This would indicate that stress caused by a lack of a sense of security may have caused women to become more open sexually during this timeframe. We all know that women instinctually respond to threat by seeking safety and security. This is a natural evolutionary response. It may be that many women sought the affections of a male partner to fill this subconscious emotional need.
    Today the effects of the terrorist attacks of Sep 11 2001 are all but gone and women are finding security within their social circles, relative peace, and a government that will support their needs. I wouldn’t worry to much as these patterns are simply a trend that will reverse and change over time.

  • TyKo Steamboat

    North or East Europe. Affordable. Better people. Hotter women.

  • ‘Reality’ Doug

    Marital rape is like gay marriage and unicorns. I don’t say force women to provide sex (unless under marriage contract). I say let them starve until they do. Making a difference is a euphamism for cannibalism. You have a White Knight neurosis implant.

  • Mr.Correcto

    Stop projecting :)

  • Mr.Correcto

    Most of us at this point are just sitting back and watching the world burn.

  • Bryan

    Your analysis is razor sharp but how do men get their social and sexual needs met under the guidelines of your argument?

  • rofl

    If everyone with political power, real life and death muzzle-at- your-temple power, buys into a fantasy– and imposes it on you– can it be dismissed?

    Is an insane, illogical falsehood everyone accepts, and acts on, still a “unicorn?”

    If you believe that, why not use a stack of hundred dollar bills to wipe your ass… or as kindling in your fireplace tonight?

    You’re not gonna do that, right? Same concept.

    Just calling it as it appears to be. Don’t give a shit otherwise.

  • DeCode

    Your advice will go completely u headed. They are too busy trying to work within the rules of female hypergamy than just pushing the bitches aside completely.

    Move overseas, hire hookers, date really young uncorrupted females only. And finally as a group, we men need to just stop putting up with their sh#t.

    American women are thy way they are because American men are sorry.

  • Ian

    What about 18-24 yos and their dating age range in Minneapolis with the white girls??? Will they do mid 30s guys?

  • DeCode

    what, I’m the only one who does this?!

  • Jack

    Normal girls are afraid of clubs they affraid they will be “eaten alive” by all these thirsty men…

  • francoseduction

    It is connected with the disintegration of the family unit. The club and at some extent bars became a substitute of the family. Girls go there to get closeness and acceptation (more than 60% of their parents are divorced) The club and “little bit” the bar give them a substitute of the family and put their “refuse sex” switch on.

    Smart guys double cross this by infiltrating social circles and then – after initial attraction – making themselves hard to get and at the same time sub-communicating Secret Society.

    In the past a girl was getting closeness and affection from the family now it is the club.. so why they would deliver sex if they can have closeness and affection without having to work for it?

    We know very well that a woman delivers only when she is not too sure of being able to bind the guy to herself..

  • DeCode

    “Sex by Berlin” was the best DJs at your dives could do for sexually provocative music in the late 90s?!? Got dayam that’s hilarious!

    I could be with the hottest chic in the world and my dick would go soft listening to that garbage.

    But point taken and I’m 100% in agreement with your solution.

  • Solo

    If you’re fit you should have no problem with that range, I have a white buddy whose 5’9 34 and he bangs chicks 22-25 all the time. Being fit, white and having game puts you in the top 20 percentile here

  • Ian

    I can say with zero reservation-for my tastes-the blonde women up there are the best in the US. I couldn’t live in an artic climate like that so i’ll be in Cali.

  • Thedude3737

    While it may not be as bad as D.C. (I’ve never been), I can absolutely vouch that I’ve encountered and observed all of the above in L.A.

  • Rubio Sol Oscuro

    NYC is possibly even worse now, I maybe caught the last few good years in the 1990s….

  • JuiceDC

    Bar game is dying. Restaurant festival and show game are the new spots. Also the event is the opener. “That last act was amazing wasn’t it? But who do they remind you of?”

  • Sam T

    I disagree. I for one as a man am interested in the opinion of women weather they be feminist or other. I for one don’t find American women attractive anymore. They are domineering and abrasive.

    When I travel the world I am pleasantly surprised at how well I’m received. So many non US women are very attractive to me. They are submissive to me as a man and that is a real turn on. Also you can still find submissive women in the U.S. you just need to know how to spot them. And trust me. They are not hanging out at D.C. bars.

  • lauraleewalker

    I am very interested in the male perspective.

    I don’t identify as being a feminist. I am not am American either.

    If your website’s policy banning women ever changes, I could provide my opinion as a Canadian female. :)

  • Sam T

    That’s good to be open minded. I don’t identify as a misogamist either but I do believe American and possibly British society is quite backwards sexually.
    To but it simply the war of the sexes rages red hot in the good old USA and other similar societies. I have traveled the world wide and only in America I see this. Single men in America are in a condition of constant sexual frustration. In general men as a species deal with frustration by taking it out in anger. The constant barrage of misogynistic speech and disrespect for women in general is due to this condition of sexual repression on males in American society.
    In turn women are taught or encouraged that male sexuality is perverted. I cant tell you how many times I have been referred to by a woman as a pervert after I complimented her on how I was attracted to a specific physical characteristic. In my opinion a man is not perverted for having sexual desire for a strange woman. Its normal and natural but this has been labeled in America an similar societies as a perverted behavior.
    From my experience male heterosexual phobia among women does not exist in Latin America, Asia, Eastern Europe, or Africa.
    My opinion, men and women should both have the same goals.
    To women, When a man is sexually attracted to you it is not an insult. If he wants to lay you take it as a compliment, even if he seems creepy. Do not demean him. Even if you choose not to sleep with him be polite and say thank you for the offer but I can’t. Also consider that casual sexual relations are not a bad thing and women can get as much out of it as men.
    To men, Be polite and respectful. Even if you are rejected (respectfully). If she does give an attitude than you can go ahead and open up the flak guns on her. At that point she will deserve it. Also keep trying and don’t fish in a dead lake. There are plenty of women in the world and many who are not cold and sour. DC is not a good example of a land of plenty. Florida where I am from seems to be much better and if you really want to experience good game Punta Cana Dominican Republic is a great place to vacation.

  • lauraleewalker

    Thank you for sharing and providing your perspective. I value it, and since you’ve also asked for mine, I would be happy to give it to you in case you might find it helpful.

    I think it’s useful between genders in any society American or otherwise try to understand each other, have that as the same goal, and accept responsibility for how things are instead of casting blame on each other.

    Both women and men have created the society you live in America, like both women and men have created the society I live in Canada.

    I feel that men and women often experience the world differently.

    It’s my understanding that the female shape, even in a simple black and white cartoon, can cause sexual desire in many men. They are aroused by the female form. It’s quite simple.

    I’ve talked to some men in my life and attempt to try on how that might feel for me to experience sexual urges as a man does.

    If we look at males and females bodies, men have more muscle mass. This means that most men can easily physically overcome a woman. Culture norms and laws aside, if a man wanted to use his force to hurt me: rape or kill me, he could. It’s the way our bodies are built.

    This reality is scary. The way women experience safety is very different than men in frequency, range of triggers and intensity. It’s a daily reality for many women to be afraid when she may hear footstep behind her increasing in pace or feel like someone is watching her and passing a group of men and contemplating turning around. It happens all the time. It’s our reality.

    Out of necessity in order to protect her young, many women developed an ability to quickly read faces to determine if her and her baby was safe or whether she would need to run or enlist the help of others.

    Sexual desire from a man can be scary, especially since they have the muscle strength to rape. Words such as creepy and pervert can be an expression of that fear.

    Also, women are often not viewed as mothers, daughters or sisters with individuals needs, wants and fears.

    They are objectified, seen as a means to an end and judged harshly based on whether they fulfil that need or not. For some a duality exists. You either fill that sexual need and are judged as a slut or you don’t and are judged as a snob (or emotionally fragile, more into their cell phones, can’t a hold a conversation, etc.) It’s a generalization, but demonstrates the duality and dangers of the objectification of women.

    I think it’s important for men and women to take responsibility for how they feel. The women you encounter can not make you feel creepy or feel like a pervert or anything else for that matter. You don’t need to internalize what they project onto you. Like you said, it’s natural for a man to have sexual desire for a strange women.

    Do you know of any other websites where men can feel like they can express themselves that allow women to also participate? I would like to further understand the men in my life that I care about.

  • Sam T

    I don’t really know of other web sites for male female discussion on relationships. They exist. Do some of your own research. I am a bachelor and have more of an interest in finding intel on how to increase my game, pick up ladies, find friendly women, have fun, etc.

  • Sam T

    Also I must add, lauraleewalker If you visit and post to this site you are only going to encounter two types of men here. Pick up artists (like myself)
    and / or
    Angry and frustrated (Men who need help from us PUAs to learn game)
    So be prepared to get responses as such,

  • lauraleewalker

    Okay, I will. Thank you. :)

    I think many women can tell within the first few minutes or less if they are interested in spending time with you.

    Making eye contact (not leering) when you first meet her and having a friendly smile goes along way. Many women need to feel comfortable before they interact with you.

    They don’t want to feel like you are going to be super aggressive and clingy and they will have to beat you off with a stick every 10 seconds.

    Don’t monopolize all of their time. Give them their space. Hang out with them for a bit then give them a chance to hang out with their friends, and find them later on, but be clear that you are interested before leaving. Repeat throughout the night.

    Also, try to find out why they are there. For example, if they look like they are there to dance, join them on the dance floor.

    There is usually more women on the dance floor than men and if you ask a lady to dance, that will give you a competitive advantage over the other men in the club who are sitting on the sidelines.

    We can also tell a lot about sexual attraction when you are close to us: the way you smell, move, your tenderness, passion, etc. It’s where we decide if we want to take things to the next level physically.

    Dilated pupils, coupled by an increase in heart rate, rhythmic movements, decreased distance between the two of you, breathing you in, and doe eyes are indicators of our level of attraction to you. Read the signals, start on their neck and forehead, read her body movements and slowly move on to her lips.

    It might sounds like a cliche, but women often love to hear a sincere compliment. Find something about her that you are really attracted by and compliment her in a none threatening way.

    Instead of saying you “look like a hot piece of ass” (we see predator looking to attack), say “you look beautiful.”

    And, if the club is not noisy, try engaging in some meaningful conversation about things that really matter to her, such as friends, family, our passions, etc. You will have miles over the men who say “So, what do you like to do for a good time?”

    Women, like men, also want to have fun at the clubs so by being fun, making them laugh, and giving them what they want (to dance, drink, find guys for their friends, etc.) you have a better chance of connecting with those you are interested in.

  • lauraleewalker

    Thank you Sam. Good to know.

  • Sam T

    Good advice and thank you. But one thing you are leaving out is women respond much better to what I refer to as “Superior Men” This can be many things to different women but from my experience Higher income and status, Being tall, Muscular, and in some cases having a large penis will get you more attention from women than If you lack these qualities.
    Whenever a woman has known about my financial status My experience is that they usually try to change and turn me into a long term commitment.
    However those times I have kept my financial status secret I many women see me as a boy toy and the sex is less restricted and I usually don’t have to wait for it. Once a woman has experienced my sexual prowess I have found that they don’t try to control me or monopolize my lifestyle. They then use me for their sexual release. In this they are just like us men. But this only happens if I keep my status secret.
    If I don’t they see me as a “keeper” and try to change me. I am not ready for that so it wont happen anytime soon. I’m enjoying being single too much.

  • lauraleewalker

    The “Superior Men” theory is interesting. All the women in my life like to feel protected, taken care of, and small and feminine which what they are most likely to feel if a man is tall and muscular. That makes sense to me.

    And, yes, generally speaking, I think the ability of a man to accumulate resources can be appealing (as well as good character, and other factors).

    I think that’s why, in part, many women respond well to men that buy their friends and them drinks. It’s a display of their ability to accumulate wealth.

    I find your experience with women interesting because many women I know that have a guy just for their sexual release never works out to be that black-and-white for them. It seems to get more complicated.

    That’s good that you’ve been able to find women that seem to want with you want then it’s a win-win situation for all.

  • Bo Jangles

    The other weekend I had a little fun, I was making out with and squeezing my latina girls tits and everything in a club, surrounded by thirsty guys. How they even think they might have a chance is beyond me…I wander over to the bar knowing shes going to get hit on, when I get back with drinks like 5 lurkers are all of a sudden gone, she managed to shut them all down. Fags.

  • Bo Jangles

    How it all went so very wrong in japan..maybe Abe will pull a little manliness out of them with a kamikazee attack on china.

  • Bo Jangles

    I agree with this..wherever you see attractive attentive women, usually there was a huge kill off not too long ago..russia being one of the worst recent losers, russian revolution, WW2. The effect was so great that nearby Azerbaijani women who are muslim to this day dress slutily.

  • Anders

    You might have read Roosh’s post on how horrible women are in Denmark. I agree with most of what he said in that post, and what he’s saying about Washington D.C. is the same as in Copenhagen: I’m fairly good looking, and when I was living in another city in 2006 I could sometimes pull women by barely even talking to them. In Copenhagen I’m absolute scum. Most women dress like morons (seriously, think Steve Urkel), and even one of the least ugly ones you can find treat you like scum. As in D.C., if you don’t have the validation of a million cool friends, you have NO chances.

    In that other city I used to get looks from women. When I went to Sicily a month ago, I got looks from women. In Copenhagen? NEVER! Over the course of three and a half years here, I can honestly only remember ONE girl looking at me on the train!

    I did day game every weekend for seven months in Copenhagen, and it was a joke! I didn’t meet up with ONE single girl who I exchainged phone numbers with. Even the PERFECT approach where I did everything right with a girl I talked to for 45 minutes on the street (usually you get 5-10 minutes), and who agreed to come for dinner at my place at a set date, ended up flaking and completely ignoring me. It was the same thing over and over again.

    “Maybe if you weren’t so bitter you could get girls”. Of course. But how can you not turn bitter when 99-100 % of your approaches fail or end up being flakes. In Finland I met up with 70 % (that’s right, SEVENTY percent) of the girls I exchanged numbers with (I counted).
    I have attached some pictures of women in Copenhagen. All of them were taken by me.

  • Sam T

    ” sexual release never works out to be that black-and-white for them. It seems to get more complicated”
    It only gets more complicated when they find out my status and try to get me to commit.

  • lauraleewalker

    I understand what you are saying. I was just imparting my experience which is that regardless of level of income or status, sex gets complicated. (Emotions get involved, someone gets knocked up, gets an STD, falls in loves, etc.)

    I’m not discounting the validity of your experience. It’s just different than what I’ve seen, but you seemed to have found a system that works for you. Good on you.

  • Lari

    Sorry Roosh. The economy is bad. If you are a decent looking not fat chic, there are so many available and willing guys out there we can easily find a good looking guy that is ready to swoop in treat you well and take care of you physically and financially. You need more than good looks and smooth talk. Even the hottest guys who aren’t financially well off end up with fat or ugly chics for this reason 😀

  • GTFO

    Get the fuck out, you attention whore. Can’t you retarded women leave men alone for even 5 minutes without trying to invade male-only space? THis is one of the very few sites that is supposed to be a male only space. The fact that you dumb cunts keep trying to invade it show that you are just an attention whore who probably didn’t get enough attention from daddy..

  • Greg Carr

    “We need to put them on an emergency Thailand expatriation plan”

    Hahaha! That knocked me out right there. I’m in Thailand right now and the women are the easiest here. I went out one night to meet a girl in Chiang Mai, and just waiting for her I had two girls go “woooo!” And touch my body and one grab my hand as she walked past me. She grabbed HARD! I had to yank my hand out of her grasp, like damn.

    I go back in September and I’m not looking forward to it. Might have to start an online business and come back, or maybe check out eastern Europe.

    One thing is the damn flakiness in USA. I get five numbers and one meets me. She is then boring or a nutcase.

    In Thailand I haven’t been stood up one fucking time. If I’m late she doesn’t care, she’s late and she tries to buy me lunch to make up for it. So black and white… Why can’t America be like this?

    Fuck, what am I gonna do…

  • Tony Trucano

    We need another war. War economy. War pussy.

  • mikediver

    It is impossible to lower your expectations of American women enough. I have tried lowering my personal expectations for decades and American women always manage to go lower, and the margin is increasing.

  • james

    Too much self hatred in your post reaper

    Why not ask why average women think they are entitled instead.

    Men are hardwired to self hatred, it is a trap you should recognize and escape. You’ll feel better for it.

  • kyle

    night game is not dead, you guys are just being pussies… I’m being a pussy. The other day, I saw two 6’5″ dudes in suits at the bar, they looked like the property bros.
    There were two well put together 6 foot girls, hanging out right next to them. The property bros spent the whole night awkwardly milling around. My friend and I made friendly advances towards the 6 foot girls, but they didn’t like the fact that we complemented them on their height. Whatever, we struck out, but we were friendly about it. Later on in the night, the blonde one ended up talking to a shot, fat guy. The black one I saw got plastered and couldn’t walk straight, made a complete fool out of herself. The whole time I was wondering why the property bros didn’t make any moves on the two tall beautiful women. Its simple, they are just pussies, like any other average guy. Women are intimidating, they hold most of the power in mate selection, it’s just a fact of life. We need to remain friendly, and remain level headed. If we strike out, we strike out. Getting aggressive or desperate about it won’t help at all. We just need to talk to girls who we find attractive, but always remain friendly and level headed.

  • ok heh

    60 yrs ago American men were oppressed by their women? That’s a laugh. Not even close to how the culture was structured at the time.

  • roman43

    Seriously, this is what mens’ attitude must be. WE rule the world, but are pussies and shooting ourselves in the foot by being thirsty.

  • roman43

    The problem is the abundance of thirsty men. Technology will not change, men must change.

  • Katana2011

    I just read this post and many of the comment’s and can relate quite well with this societal change! I’m 52 and an x-bartender, and I know, well past my prime! I recently went with a couple younger friends of mine to go ‘bar hopping’, as we used to call it! I was SHOCKED by what I saw and encountered! I saw very little male-female interaction, with very little interaction in general! I noticed that sitting alone at the bar today, is now considered the same as sitting on pervert row at a topless bar back in the day!! I made some comparisons to what I saw in the mid-eighties compared to now. I’m out of free time now and will post my observations soon!

  • Rob

    Roosh, can you do a comparison between conservative towns/cities and liberal towns/cities? I have a feeling the reason DC is so terrible is because of the politics of the women who live there – exceedingly liberal.

    By the way, I was in DC recently and I couldn’t believe how ugly the girls were. I could count on one hand the number of good-looking women I saw and they were all taken. And the women who I met at the bar were gross because they had no qualms about stepping out to smoking every fifteen minutes, being loud, talking openly about men they found attractive in mixed company and generally acting like men. What a depressing place to live. Thank God I don’t live there.

  • BrazilianGuy

    Fascinating how everything written here applies to the city I live (Sao Paulo, Brazil).

  • BrazilianGuy

    “Bars and clubs have always been a terrible way to get girls”.

    I don’t agree. Back to 2000’s it was really easy.

  • Jams

    I truly think that this will be the case. Probably sooner than we think. Think about it, a 10 who fucks, talks to you nicely, doesn’t stink, and is just pleasurable to have around has got to beat 99% of women. At least American women, which, unfortunately, is all I’ve dealt with.

  • Jams

    I love this. Don’t forget that she needs to pay for it all.

  • TheDidact

    Replace the word “bot” with laptop, and you will see how incorrect that statement is.

  • Sports Droppings

    “Learned Autism.” Well played, sir. (*stealing this)