The Busted Dudes Test

The Western man is faced with a lot of choices on where to spend his extended vacations. There are too many countries and too many conflicting reports. One guy says England is a fuck fest while another says the girls are cows. One guy says the Dominican Republic is prostitute-central while another says it’s cheap and fun. If you’re looking to stay in a place for a short while, how do you decide?

I’ve lived abroad for a total of two years now and have finally discovered the only quality you need to look for when deciding where to stay:

Is it common to see a busted guy with a pretty girl on his arm?

That’s all I look for now. If within my first day in a country I see pretty girls with busted dudes who aren’t decked out in Hugo Boss or gold jewelry, I know the country will be good to me because that means the sexual market is skewed in the man’s favor. It means I can get a girl much prettier than I am handsome in shorter time periods, possibly without having to even use game. Not only that, but the country will be cheap, because if it was “rich” then those pretty girls would be going out with guys who were wearing the Hugo Boss and gold bling.

In America, I rarely see busted dudes with hot girls. It happens once every six months. It’s actually sad how common I see decent-looking men with hogs.

In Denmark, I never saw a busted dude with a hot girl. Not once. Girls there always were able to move up in terms of attractiveness while guys moved down.

In Iceland, the guys sometimes had to date down, but it was more common for couples to be equally attractive.

In Argentina and Colombia, the level of attractiveness was mostly equal. Good looking girls were with good-looking guys, though sometimes I did see weird mullet dudes with hotties.

In Brazil, girls were prettier than the guys. Too many times I saw busted dudes or straight-up dorks with model-looking girls.

In Poland, girls are also prettier than the guys. That balding Polish guy I saw yesterday with zero style, a fanny pack, and a Sloth face had a nice girl that everyone reading right now would wife up.

Out of the above list, do you want to guess the two countries where I pulled an amazing girl within my first week? I’m talking about girls who just about blew away any girl I happened to meet in the previous year. Don’t think too hard now.

Brazil and Poland. Day five and day three, respectively.

In Brazil I look like a native while in Poland I look exotic, but my appearance is only a minor factor when compared to the fact that women in those countries don’t have a good selection of men. For two months in Denmark I banged the ugliest chicks I have in years, and then I get off the plane in Poland and right away slept with a beautiful girl who did everything to please me. I struggled like a dog in Argentina and then slept with the most beautiful girl I ever have in my life not even a week in Rio. Things like my game, style, and so on have their effects, but the power of the local dating market is such that it’s possible to hear stories of regular guys spending two weeks in Brazil and meeting the most amazing women they have in their lives. But in Denmark? Ireland? Australia? Yeah, right.

How about other countries?

Spain and Italy. Beautiful girls, but equally handsome men. Hard to date up. Men are known for visiting whorehouses, especially in Spain, which is not a good sign.

Belgium, Austria, Germany. Power shifted towards sloppy, feminist women. You will have to date down or equal to your level.

Russia, Ukraine, Romania, Bulgaria, Balkans. Busted dudes with pretty girls. You can date up up up.

Thailand, Philippines. Average-looking girls but nonexistent male competition. You can date up.

Game doesn’t help a whole lot if there is a surplus of dudes and a shortage of beautiful girls. You’ll do what I did in Denmark and waste it on 5s and 6s for one-night stands that make you feel shitty the next day. You’ll do what I have done in Washington DC and carry the Britannica of game on your back just to get with 7s. Please don’t repeat my mistakes and spend months or years in places where the environment is working against you every time you walk out the door.

You can even use the busted dudes test within your own country to pick which city to live in. While Washington DC is horribly tilted against men, how about New York City, Austin, or Charlotte? If your only determinant of where to live is the “job market,” your dick is going to hate you.

To pick a place worth staying, all you need to use in your eyes. Look at the couples holding hands and give each person a 1-10 rating. If the girl ratings are higher than the guys, it’s time to search for an apartment and stay for as long as you can, even if it’s just for a weekend or two.

When I was younger and more insecure, I’d get jealous that busted dudes were with pretty girls. I used to resent the fact that he got a chance to move up, but not anymore. Now when I see an ugly dude with a girl I’d fuck, I smile, because he’s a sign that I can get a girl much prettier than I am handsome with a fraction of the effort. If all those regular local dudes can date up, that means I can do the same.

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  • http://www.thegmanifesto.com The G Manifesto

    I will add one:

    Riga, Latvia: guys with insanely fly girls that would get blanked in Southern California.

    “the power of the local dating market”

    I really think this is one of the hugest factors out there.

    Once your Game is top notch, this is going to play a huge roll.

    However, it is only one factor.

    Riga, Latvia, for instance, I didn’t find easy at all.

    Although sometimes I wonder if I went to a different “Riga, Latvia” that some others have been. Some guys say there are tons of prostitutes there. I think I got solicited only once my entire stay.

    - MPM

  • The Specimen

    In Italy, I think it depends on where you go. If you stay away from touristy cities where you hear lots of English and will find lots or Americans like Venice, Rome, Milan, and especially Florence (a haven for American fatties) what you’re saying is true. Rome and Milan are a little weird due to all of the money and European foreigners there. If you go some place smaller and less touristy like Verona or in the real country where they rarely see Americans like Trento or something, you’ll start to see hotties with total betas. Also, you really do need to be able to speak a little bit of Italian if you’re going to game in Italy.

  • Vicious

    Interesting observation, I think I’ll have to employ this “test” when abroad the next time.

  • Anonymous

    Roosh, could you expand a little on what underlying factors might cause a given country’s sexual market to be skewed in favor of men. There are plenty of men in Brazil and Poland. Why do you say that in both of those countries, “women don’t have a good selection of men”?

    Is it a question of male/female ratio?

    Is it a question of income and level of feminist development, ie the status of high-earning males who are not alcoholic is much higher in places like Brazil and Poland than in countries like Denmark, where the welfare state substitutes for high-earning men?

    As a Jew, I’ve often wondered why my people ever left the beautiful and mellow Mediterranean to move to godforsaken places like Russia and Poland. I believe I have the real answer now!

  • Basil Ransom

    Montreal. Saw lots of same-height couples there, and very cute girls, but the dudes have more swagger.

    I met a successful male dancer once, who’d instruct girls by the thousand. He said a little town called Trois Riviere in Canada was the best he’d ever seen.

  • http://twitter.com/#!/LeonidasMyL Leo

    How’s the particular case of Bogotá, Colombia?

  • http://twitter.com/#!/LeonidasMyL Leo

    I’m having a hard time in Bogotá, Colombia with decent game… (Flakey girls)

  • Shawn

    Poor countries seem to have ugly guys.

  • Rafa

    Let me tell you something about Spain.

    Here we have a combination of catholic tradition and feminist bullshit combined at the same time. Quality scorts from other countries are available at competitive prices and are not illegal.

    But let me tell you something I experimented myself. Visiting prostitutes improved my game. I know it sounds counterproductive and could make no sense for you. But, for me, it helped me a lot in the beginning.

    To score 9s and 10s, you need a ton of PATIENCE (as well as game, of course). So at first, when it’s time to ‘fake ’till you make it’, buying sex with high class scorts teaches not to be impressed by beauty and having my sex needs met (but if you are not cautious, you can fall in the trap of pedestalizing pussy since you’re paying for it).

    Just my two cents.

  • Anonymous

    I curse the day my ancestors came to America. It began a chain of events that inexorably led to me going through my life considering myself a loser. I wished they’d just stayed in Russia and toughed it out for 100 years :bigsmile:

  • http://www.torontopickup.com Bigfoot

    I’ll keep an eye out for this while I’m walking around in Toronto.
    To be honest I’ve seen some decent looking guys with some fat ugly girls here, that doesn’t bode well….

  • jgalt

    6,7. I did very well in Bogota. I have banged 4 girls in about three weeks I have been here. Morover they were hotter then what I could get back home. I do speak perfect spanish though so my game is pretty tight here. They do flake more but are a lot easier to game, guys here are Betas to the point that girls talk about how much they suck.

    Good luck

  • Marmot

    Hmph. I was recently in Poland and I agree with your observation about busted dudes. It really reaches incredible levels there, and not just in looks but also in pathetic beta behavior. However, I wasn’t able to score with a Polish girl, just an Australian one who was travelling like me. Still, it’s a good test.

  • http://www.hokieblogger.com Gmac

    This is the bright side of having learned and improved game in a city like D.C. I know that anywhere else I go it can’t really be much worse, and my game will almost always take me to heights I’d never experience at home. I get a taste of this every time I take a vacation somewhere else and come home with a few new notches.

  • Rakishness

    “Game doesn’t help a whole lot if there is a surplus of dudes and a shortage of beautiful girls. You’ll do what I did in Denmark and waste it on 5s and 6s for one-night stands that make you feel shitty the next day. You’ll do what I have done in Washington DC and carry the Britannica of game on your back just to get with 7s. Please don’t repeat my mistakes and spend months or years in places where the environment is working against you every time you walk out the door.”
    Truth..while living in such a harsh environment may improve your game. Why waste precious time such a place?

    “You can even use the busted dudes test within your own country to pick which city to live in. While Washington DC is horribly tilted against men, how about New York City, Austin, or Charlotte? If your only determinant of where to live is the “job market,” your dick is going to hate you.”
    Gospel

  • http://johnnyshornofplenty.wordpress.com/ Johnny Milfquest

    Krauser proposed the female looks vs male looks couples comparison as a benchmark for Game.

    If a guy dates up, his game is good. If a guy dates down, his game sucks.

  • Carmo

    A few years back, before I had solid game I laid a local Spanish girl in San Sebastian(north of Spain). I always had more confidence and charisma when traveling abroad so I still did decent when overseas.

    It took what I thought was an eternity at the time, 4 nights and a several cases of blue balls but I got the flag. I am going to say that the strong religious foundations and the close knit family plays a very strong factor so a lot depends on getting lucky and finding the right girl.

  • George

    Wow, great point.

    Eastern Europe & Asia for the win!

    Manhattan: Lots of hotties running around, but very rare to see couples. Couples are usually older. Even for dudes dressed with money, it’s very rare to see them with a girl. Usually see them with an older, gold-digger type. The average couple is an average dude with an average to chubby girl.

    Austin: dick central.

  • mr pilkington

    I gotta cosign Montreal. I saw straight up herbs with top shelf bitches. It was like bizarro America.

  • V

    I’ve often thought about how all the decent guy with fugly girl couples were a consequence of the low quality of American women, but I never thought of it this way. Excellent idea.

    About the shitty girls in DC.
    At my university, two graduate programs send a predominant number of their graduates to DC, Public Policy & Environment. The girls in these programs also have the most skewed perception of their own desirability. These girls will be 5’3″ 140lbs, and wear flip flops 24/7. But they expect a man who is 6’2″, in shape and dresses well.

    The graduate program with the cutest girls who have the most realistic understanding of their own looks sends most of its graduates to rural areas. Over 90% of these girls are at least cute, and are the feminine wifey types.

    DC gets our shit. Anytown, USA gets the gold.

  • Timothy

    I know just about all of us, when seeing a fat/ugly dude with a honey, would say to ourselves, “he must have a lot of money.” I never thought about other reasons for it, but the factors illustrated make some sense. Women will make due with what is available, and if something better/different rolls in, even temporarily, someone will respond to it.

  • http://www.thegmanifesto.com The G Manifesto

    “I gotta cosign Montreal. I saw straight up herbs with top shelf bitches. It was like bizarro America.”

    My question is this:

    Does this help you if you are weesh?

    Does it hurt you if you are smooth?

    Or vice versa?

    - MPM

  • Shawn

    Countries that have a lot of gender equality tend to allow for the economic advancement of women.

    Once women are able to get their own dough, they don’t need to bother as much to make themselves look better in order to get a guy with a decent income. Countries like Brazil, for example, will have a lot of unemployed women or women in shit service jobs so they have to look good to get a guy with a little cash, often at the expense of looks.

  • http://Alpha'sGirlfriend Lost Gringo

    I can honestly say that this was the best piece I’ve read from you yet. You hit it, spot on. No bs, no bragging, no silly slang – just the straight and level. Your analysis of the foreign markets you noted is about the same as mine. When I get off a plane, the first thing I look for is the quality of women, and then who they are with. There are few better experiences for the seasoned traveler than walking down the street and seeing some stunner in a cafe, sitting with Frankenstein. It is a thing of pure beauty. The only thing better would be to see a local man treating a woman like shit – and watching her take it. In a market like that, just behaving like a decent human being puts you in the top of the gene pool, not to mention the dating pool.

  • BalkanCynic

    One reason for such mismatches is the trend in some culture to marry your high school sweethearts. Chicks never get to breakup and upgrade for the dude who can afford the designer clothes.

  • K.

    I’ll back up George on Austin being a sausage-party.

    But there are a couple of different dating subcultures that each have a different gender ratio. There are the fratty UT folks that stayed in town after graduation. Guys and girls seem evenly matched with the girls being boring-hot and the guys being pretty douchey but also probably handsome in a Jersey Shore sort of way. Then there is the hipsters who typically work service sector here for a couple of years before blowing through their parents’ money. There might actually be more hipster girls than guys since you certainly see hot hipster girls with doofus hipster guys. And then there’s the professional/transplant scene which is an absolute sausage-fest.

    So you probably don’t need money to be socially successful here (in fact, flaunting wealth is looked down on). But you do need a certain social capital. I suspect if you come down here aimless, work in a service sector job, you could do okay. Or if you have Texas connections. But if you come here to work tech or go to grad school in a guy-dominated field, you’re going to have a very hard time.

    Austin has a reputation for having a lot of hot girls, but I think it might just be who tourists run into (hot waitresses and hot college students on Sixth).

  • Girl From Woodbridge, Virginia

    This is terrible. You sound like you are admitting that you are a busted beta who has to go where there are other busted betas in order to pick up decent looking women.

  • nguyenimproved

    ingenius and original post.

    it’s great when Roosh harnesses the powers of science for evil not good.
    and gives the findings in layman’s terms.

    or un-laid men’s terms.

    very observant.

  • Pimpan

    Toronto is hard to pin down. There are a lot of dumpy women, but the couples seem to be close to even. If anything, it goes both ways here. Making me think it’s the guys who have poor game vs. the girls who are too picky (I know lots of both).

  • Rob

    Roosh, et al., my company is considering throwing me into Phnom Penh, Cambodia for a couple of years… I’ve never been to Asia, and although I don’t have yellow fever, I do see some real beauty in East Asia. I’m white and a polyglot, so the language won’t take long to learn. Anyone have any hints, tips or suggestions about living in East Asia?

  • Anonymous

    @ Girl from Woodbridge

    If you aren’t ugly/fat and don’t wear flip flops we can hang out.

  • Roosh

    “could you expand a little on what underlying factors might cause a given country’s sexual market to be skewed in favor of men. ”

    Don’t over-analyze. The information you’re looking for won’t help your dick. The test is all you need.

    “This is the bright side of having learned and improved game in a city like D.C. I know that anywhere else I go it can’t really be much worse”

    I said this to myself for many years to alleviate my suffering. Until it no longer did and I had to get out. Plus it only applies to other American cities. International travel requires more adjustments.

    “If a guy dates up, his game is good. If a guy dates down, his game sucks.”

    In America, sure. In Eastern Europe it says little.

    “You sound like you are admitting that you are a busted beta who has to go where there are other busted betas”

    Says a girl who is living in a place where she has a clear advantage. Almost anywhere else in the world you’d be considered garbage, so stfu and enjoy all the drunk dudes hitting on you.

  • Shopaholic

    I’m a polish female and to be honest…

    I know exactly what you mean by “sloth faced men”

    But I find them really really hot and sexy. They are so manly :)

  • Anonymous

    Austin seems great at first, but it’s pretty fucking bad. For every 1 hot girl, there are 4 overweight, ugly or bitchy friends that followed them here because “it’s such a great city!”. Not to mention the widespread mindset of “keep Austin weird” leads people to try and look or dress uniquely or unconventionally, which basically means trying to out ugly each other. I’ve never seen so many girls with short hair that dress like dudes or are just complete bitches. Also there are a ton of dudes here, thanks to the proximity to military bases, high number of universities and just the knowledge that Austin is the best party town around.

    On the flipside, you can do well here if you are willing to put in serious amounts of work, but it’d be better served in an actual metropolis like Chicago, DC or New York.

  • Gross

    @32

    Obviously, you are busted, just look at yourself. You’re easily one of the ugliest people I’ve ever seen. I know you’re not dating any better than a 2 no matter what country you’re in. Talk about delustional.

  • Anonymous

    Re: Austin, the attractiveness ratio in couples is pretty even here across the social spectrum. Every once in a while I’ll see some fug dude with a hot girl, but it’s few and far in between.

  • Basil Ransom

    IMO, the secret to getting a hot girl is not pickup per se.

    The times I’ve seen hot girls with regular guys is when they met through a social circle. It’s like someone said about high school sweethearts. If a higher value girl hasn’t had her ego ratcheted up by clubbing and drinking every week, and you’re in her circle, it’s exponentially easier to game her and get her.

    When you’re in her social circle, the default assumption is that you’re of equal value. Run tight game, and your value rises. This is immediately and abundantly apparent in say, college Greek life. If you’re both in top houses, her shield will be a lot lower.

    Compare with approaching her elsewhere: you’re just another speck in a huge throng of dongs. You’re swimming with your legs tied. Even with tight game, you’re starting at a disadvantage.

  • Rot

    Only thing I would caution is assuming chicks are “with” a dude just cuz they are standing near each other. I find that guys way to often assume their way out of eligible women. If they aren’t touching or making out assume single and take a shot

  • http://www.hokieblogger.com Gmac

    @35

    Pot Kettle Black?

    You’re either a troll or delusional — borderline retarded.

  • Gross

    @39
    Roosh V is ugly — even troll’s have 20/20 eyesight. IQ is 142 — hardly retarded.

  • YorySesca

    You jackasses ought to spend as much of your time worrying about serious stuff and not what makes americant whores, like the whore from Woodbridge, tick. This site is entertaining, alot of insight into how neurotic americants are.

  • mr. pilkington

    @ G manifesto
    I think being smooth never hurts it will put you ahead of the “competition” in Montreal. I think dudes up there don’t appreciate how good they have it.

  • Rudebwoy

    London – struggled like a dog and dated girls below me.

  • Peter

    Epic post! You seem to be coming to all the same conclusions that I have. Game is really just teaching beta males how to fake being alpha. But it really doesn’t work and also it’s hard to be someone you are not for a long period of time. As a beta I would rather just go somewhere and find girls that genuinely like betas. Hard to find here but there has got to be a few cities…

  • AZJohn

    Regarding other reader’s comments about male/female ratio:

    I think the absolute male/female ratio is useless when it comes to gauging the mating market because of the paradox of female hypergamy.

    I was born and raised near San Francisco California, and never realized how bad it was there for PUA until I moved to Tucson Arizona during college. I was never an alpha, but I wasn’t a hopeless beta either. I was somewhere in between, I had some game, but needed to improve it with more practice. My game improved dramatically when I moved to Tucson.

    You would think with so many gays in San Fran, the male/female ratio skewing would favor males, but it doesn’t. That’s because the absolute ratio isn’t really a big factor. Women are hypergamous by nature. On average, 70% of the women want to date 30% of the top men. Losing 5-10% of the male population to homosexuality from the bottom of the pack doesn’t really alter the overall mating market for women, because they don’t even consider those guys part of the mating pool.

    The best indicator for gauging the mating market is to look for the presence and strength of hypergamy. In countries/cultures/cities, etc where hypergamy is discouraged (women are encouraged or pressured into marrying young), male/female ratio is even, the mating market is favorable for men. In places where it is acceptable for women to delay marriage, hypergamy is strong, and the mating market is bad for men.

    Always remember this: if 5 women were given the choice of being single for a longtime, but having a small chance of marrying a top dog among themselves (meaning they’ll have to share him over time), vs being married to a lowly beta but guaranteed to have their own man, 3 out of 5 women would pick option 1. They would prefer to stay single and wait for their turn instead of going for the sure thing.

  • Watchman

    This is probably the most sensible game advice I’ve ever read. Where you are makes a massive difference. The only point I’d disagree with is saying Thais are average looking. Bangkok has some of the hottest women on the planet. I’m guessing roosh isn’t into Asian chicks.

  • http://dudequest.wordpress.com/ Brigadon

    Salt Lake City:

    Busted dudes, massive surplus of hot chicks. Your opponents are mormon boys who wouldn’t know assertiveness if it bit them on the ass.

    West valley, places like the Busy bee or even southern exposure, even the downtown park during drum circle on sundays. You can bang ANY girl you want to, be she mormon, married, single, whatever.

    Massive beta surplus. and there are not quite as many penalties as gaming someplace like DC or Maryland.

    If anyone is gonna visit Salt Lake (Not park city) for hunting purposes, drop me a line… I can hook you up with a list of good day gaming spots (There’s very little night game out here)and places to avoid.

  • Santos Trafficante

    “For two months in Denmark I banged the ugliest chicks I have in years”

    During the last 10 years or so mass immigration from more favorable places has improved the selection pool considerably in the big cities of Western Europe. Sure they’re not easy, because they know their local value, but did you only go after ethnic Danish chicks then? Or is Denmark an ugly exception?

  • http://dudequest.wordpress.com/ Brigadon

    Oh, and Provo. holy SHIT what a market. I see John Candies around constantly with good 8′s. BYU is highly femcrazy, but that means that they are on the prowl constantly for alphas… just be careful, because condom-needling and other batshit plans for forcing marriage are common as dirt. Use a fake name and hide your used condoms.

  • OGNorCal707

    Good post Roosh, very true, and straight to the point.

    “Game doesn’t help a whole lot if there is a surplus of dudes and a shortage of beautiful girls. You’ll do what I did in Denmark and waste it on 5s and 6s for one-night stands that make you feel shitty the next day. You’ll do what I have done in Washington DC and carry the Britannica of game on your back just to get with 7s. Please don’t repeat my mistakes and spend months or years in places where the environment is working against you every time you walk out the door.”

    This pretty much sums up my life right now, in the small NorCal town I’m in. Girls that are 6′s act like they are 8′s and girls who are 8′s think they’re fucking perfect 10 models. Sometimes I feel like me and my boys are working like dogs, just for measly scraps ( in the form of girls in the 5-7 range). I like to try to keep standards for looks up, but it’s hard to do, if you want to get laid regularly, and don’t have a LTR. I need to get the fuck out of here, and onto greener pastures.

  • speakeasy

    These are the kind of insightful posts that keep me reading this blog for now a couple years. Never even thought about this angle but now every time I step out the door I’m going to be paying close attention to this.

  • gramercy

    “In America… It’s actually sad how common I see decent-looking men with hogs.”

    So true. Just yesterday I saw an example of this: a fat, ugly female acquaintance of mine (with that typical American female sloppy style and overbearing personality) with a guy who was tall, thin, good-looking and polite. Wtf?

  • speakeasy

    @45

    “You would think with so many gays in San Fran, the male/female ratio skewing would favor males, but it doesn’t. That’s because the absolute ratio isn’t really a big factor. Women are hypergamous by nature. On average, 70% of the women want to date 30% of the top men. Losing 5-10% of the male population to homosexuality from the bottom of the pack doesn’t really alter the overall mating market for women, because they don’t even consider those guys part of the mating pool. ”

    I think you illustrated very well what goes on out there in the clubs and bars every night in almost any city in America. The women in these places seem to have disinterest at best and contempt at worst for 80% of the men in the venue. They think they are entitled to the top 20% of men and those are the only ones they respond well too. This of course is why the 80/20 rule is so strong in the field. This is why there has been an explosion of PUA products in the last decade. The 80% of men getting 20% of the all the sex are looking for a way out. Women are also quick to blow off a completely decent guy for trivial reasons. UGLY, out of shape women are PICKY.

    “The best indicator for gauging the mating market is to look for the presence and strength of hypergamy. In countries/cultures/cities, etc where hypergamy is discouraged (women are encouraged or pressured into marrying young), male/female ratio is even, the mating market is favorable for men. In places where it is acceptable for women to delay marriage, hypergamy is strong, and the mating market is bad for men.”

    Hmm…But it would seem to me that low hypergamy would mean women get hitched younger and there is less less casual sex to go around.

    I’m not so sure the late marrying age of American women is due so much to hypergamy as it is due to feminism. Women in feminist cultures place more emphasis on career and “accomplishments” than finding a man and starting a family. They want both, but career is clearly their first priority.

  • nguyenimproved

    @clockguy:
    thais are pretty ugly by asian standards.
    quite brown.

    they’re friendly but.

    @33i never really checked out the guys in poland before but a brazilian guy i went there with noticed that whereas the women were good-looking the guys were dirt.

    he did really well with his height and charisma- hooked up some 6foot blonde polish bank teller our first night out.

    she had apparently asked if i was his son, and im not even that short.

    did notice the girls in poland were underfed (thumbs up)
    and on a weird sidenote actually noticed two teenage girls in different cities with scars from cutting up their wrists.

    roosh hadn’t passed through yet so couldn’t be blamed.

  • Evan

    Roosh, you are owed deepest thanks for your continuing service to men and country.

  • Anonymous

    @27,35

    breastiality might be a better option for you two,leave the human gene pool already.no one wants you.

  • noman

    Roosh wrote: “Says a girl who is living in a place where she has a clear advantage. Almost anywhere else in the world you’d be considered garbage, so stfu and enjoy all the drunk dudes hitting on you.”

    HAHA so true. American girls have no idea how easy they have it. They walk into a bar and ‘successful,’ somewhat intelligent, clean-cut men approach them within minutes. Even if the girl is a flip-flop wearing, Chipotle-obsessed hag.

  • Carmo

    Saint Petersburg FL- Although there are plenty of dumpy women here, there is an astonishing amount of hot young tail whored out at the club weekend nights. Your competition is your typical douchebag but if you are a normal cool guy with game you are all set.

    The women are hot but dumb as shit with nothing going for them other than their looks & their tan. One night stands are very common. All in all, not a bad place to put up some good numbers, just don’t marry them.

  • The Specimen

    I’d always thought roosh was being a little hard on American females until I did a little travelling and got to see stuff in just a small other slice of the world. Roosh is dead right. American girls for the most part are the most self overrated, entitled princesses, with the shittiest attitudes that the world has to offer.

    Not to mention that so many are just sloppy and out of shape. It’s not that all American chicks are fat, it’s that when you see loud, obnoxious, fat chick in Europe, it’s pretty safe to assume that she’s from the states. In fact, I’ve actually started to really dislike American tourists in general and avoid them like the plague when I’m abroad.

    American chicks don’t even have a clue how outclassed they are, even by Canadian women. Maybe the only ones who can compete for the razzie are the brits and some of the auzzies. Any man who marries an American woman is cheating himself.

  • http://sjones84.blogspot.com/ Solo

    Is DC really that bad?

  • Jezebel Meme Fan

    So what you’re saying is that no matter what the pussy you get looks like, you’re still a busted fucked-up ugly aging loser. I can’t believe you just admitted you can’t pull quality ass anywhere but some third-world hellhole.

    Meanwhile, better men and hot chicks get laid every single day. Funny how that works.

  • http://dudequest.wordpress.com/ Brigadon

    No, Jezebel. what he’s saying is that most local HB10′s are just plain too much work for too little reward. Elsewhere they have a healthy appreciation for a well-put-together male, and haven’t been taught by femcunts like you to hate men and themselves.

    I don’t care how beautiful a woman is. if she has been trained to be a hateful cunt, she is not worth the time it takes to rub your cockhead on her tonsils.

  • Carmo

    @61 “some third-world hellhole”

    Thanks for proving him right. Only somebody who has not traveled still clings to the antiquated notion that America is the greatest place on earth. Every time I return from abroad I get depressed but hey that’s just me. Enjoy your Wal-Mart’s and McDonald’s, I hear the McRib is coming back so you have that to look forward to.

  • Kievy

    Happy Birthday Roosh…

  • beta_plus

    While I have not been there, I’m skeptical that Austin wins on the busted dudes test compared to DC. As for NYC, it’s possibly better there than DC, but not only marginally. When you factor in the hassle of moving, increase of cost of living, difficulty of basic living, and difficult job market, it’s probably not worth the effort to get an extra edge.

    Charlotte, OTOH, I’m curious about. After seeing the Research Triangle, it definitely qualifies under the busted dudes test, so other places in the South might as well (Charleston comes immediately to mind).

  • RAW

    So true. While only spending time in Brazil in Argentina, I can’t tell you the amount of times I saw in Brazil an absolute smoke show with legs of a thoroughbred with some skinny short nerd. Never seen anything like it anywhere.

  • Terp

    I moved to Towson, Maryland after graduating from UMD College Park because I saw so busted dudes with hot chicks up there. Towson U has huge education + nursing programs and a much better ratio than UMD. It was the best decision I ever made.

    It’s important to know game, but man if you can find a place where the sexual economics are biased in your favor, it just makes life a lot more enjoyable!

  • http://solvemygirlproblems.com Shark

    Whenever I see a celebrity with a fat girlfriend, I think to myself,

    “Thank God game is real”

  • ExtPtMagz

    @45

    Chicago here.

    I was in San Francisco for 9 months and you are right. Its awful there. I went to SF expecting to see easy going, laid back hippie crowd, but instead, all I saw was stuck-up angry tattooed up bitches.

    One hour to the south in San Jose wasn’t bad though, but quality was on the poor side, with 6-7′s being top. Saw much friendlier crowd in clubs as compared to SF.

  • Squared

    Great post Roosh. I haven’t had the chance to travel much, but I’ll be keeping an eye open for this… Or not, given that I now know where I’ll be travelling anyways. Thanks fellas.

    By the way, I’m afraid the guys who mentioned Montreal are being overly optimistic. Take it from a guy who has lived near this city his entire life. It’s true that the average beauty quotient is higher here than just about anywhere else in North America. But this applies to the guys as well. I’m quite handsome myself, and I don’t really stand out in Montreal.

    As for the busted dude test, from what I’ve seen, the result is similar to what another commentator alluded to about Toronto. If I had to put a number on it, I would say that about 60% of couples are a compatible match, 30% of the time the guy is slumming it, and 10% of the time the guy is dating out of his league. And from that last group, the guy generally had something else going for him (namely money, the vast majority of the time).

  • Codeazure

    @54 If you look at typical Thai prostitutes in bars in Thailand, they are mostly from the poor North East & tend to be very brown.

    But look around in Bangkok at women who are not poor and non-pros. You will see a lot of very pale skinned, utterly gorgeous women. There are a lot of Chinese descent, hence the difference.

    Thai society treats dark skin as poor/low class and pale skin as high class. So women do everything to avoid getting tanned. They think foreigners are insane for sunbathing :-)

    I live is Sydney, (Aus, not Canada) which sucks at the busted dude test. Perth is better, but Australia can’t compare to SE Asia or the other places mentioned. We’re just a couple of steps behind the catastrophe in the US.

  • George2

    It’s so hard to really give credence to what other men report because so much ego goes into everyone’s judgments. A lot of times if a guy gets rejected by girls from a particular country he’ll just say they’re ugly. 9 times out of ten that’s the case.

    I’m from NYC, and am right now in Kiev, Ukraine. I came here thinking the girls would blow American girls out of the water. That’s what everyone says. Supposedly Kiev girls are even prettier than Polish girls.

    Well, turns out that was a complete crock. NYC has way better quality, hands down. The girls here are all thin and dress well, and are feminine. I will give them that, and those things are not trivial. But pretty? It is extremely rare to see genuinely pretty faces. More common to see good bodies, but many have no shape. Style is not great either.

    And Ukrainian chics are probably the best in Eastern Europe.

    The girls here are a particular type. To guys who are not good with girls and have never been with genuinely pretty, classy faces, Eastern European girls might seem hot. They are kind of sexy in a feminine kind of way. For myself, I categorize them as “3 beer” girls. They look good after 3 beers. They have the right sillhouette, they dress sexy, if you’re drunk their poor features are not so noticeable.

    But they are quite average overall, much worse than Manhattan girls. Manhattan girls are much more masculine and intense, but much, much prettier. Oh well, there goes another fantasy overboard. I had such high hopes for Eastern European chics.

    On my way here I stopped in London – the girls were hot! What a surprise! Another misconception thrown in the dustbin. Supposedly London is full of uglies, but the truth is there are refined, classy, thin, well dressed beauties everywhere, and they are English girls. Moreover, English girls are sweet, pleasant, feminine, refined, and elegant – much more so than Manhattan girls! Not quite as hot as NYC girls, but much more pleasant. I used to think English girls were as masculine as American ones, but I now see that the middle to upper class English girls are incredibly pleasant, smiley, and feminine. Pretty much as feminine as Eastern Europeans.

    America really is in many ways a masculinzed country compared to the rest of the world. Even in Kiev the people – guys as well as girls – are soft. I never realized how hard Americans are. Maybe it’s just New York.

    It’s incredibly sad for me to bury my Eastern European dream – the fact is, the best looking girls (as well as the worst looking girls) are in the West and American. Yes, London may have lots of fatties, but it has tons of hot girls the likes of which cannot be found in Kiev. Same with NYC, where I live. The more I travel the more I realize the best looking girls, despite the fatties, are in America and parts of Western Europe. I know many will disagree, but I think they are deluding themselves. Which is fine if they are happy. If only American girls were more feminine!

    As for Thailand, lived there for a few years and it’s one of my favorite countries. The girls, however, are NOT hot even by Asian standards. There are certainly good looking girls there, but few. To some degree it suffers from the same situation as Eastern Europe. Thai girls are feminine and dress well but are essentially “3 beer” girls, so to guys who are not used to pretty girls they will pass as beautiful. In detail, it is rare to see genuinely pretty faces on Thai girls, but if you’re not used to pretty girls, you can be fooled by the glitz and glitter.

    Finally, while I think this is a very perceptive post in general, the logic is a bit faulty. Game holds that looks and money don’t matter terribly much in getting girls, so if you are in a country where you see ugly dudes with no money hooking up with hot girls, the correct conclusions is that the guys have game in those countries. This is according to game theory. I’m actually quite surprised, Roosh, that you would attribute so much value to looks and money, which you have been doing more and more of late. You seem to be losing some of your faith, at least, in game.

  • http://dudequest.wordpress.com/ Brigadon

    @71

    I think you must have been in a different part of Thailand as me. the heavily french-influenced areas have hotties the likes of which I have never seen elsewhere. admittedly, NY has some of the hottest babes on the planet (including Thai looking ones) but most of them seem… used up. as if too much drugs and partying has destroyed most of their appeal. like the ‘hot women’ in sex and the city, they mostly look washed out.

    Then again, I never really found the ‘anna nicole smith’ type enticing. give me a Jordana Brewster type any day of the week and I will dump the marylin monroes like they are made out of plutonium.

  • Ron

    Just saw this page… is it accurate to your experiences Roosh?

    http://thechive.com/2011/06/14/what-supermodels-look-like-by-country-26-photos/

  • George2

    Brigadon, I agree there is something off-putting about New York girls – a certain lack of femininity, if you will – despite their incredible hotness and relative ease of getting into bed.

    The more I go around the world the more I see that you just can’t have everything in one package – it’s always a trade-off. The promised land doesn’t exist.

  • Gattuso

    George2,

    Completely agreed that English girls get short shrift in these game sites. I found them to be sweeter, more feminine and more intelligent than their American cohorts. The looks can vary, but there were enough attractive ones at university where I studying abroad.

  • Roosh

    “Moreover, English girls are sweet, pleasant, feminine, refined, and elegant – much more so than Manhattan girls!”

    I have to call bullshit on this. I’ve traveled enough in dirty hostels to meet dozens of English girls, and not just the hippie ones. They are so similar to American girls it’s painful. I’ve also met a lot of ragged English girls in America. Too many guys on my forum confirm this:

    http://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-4913.html

    Please enlighten us as to where you’re meeting these magical English girls. And are you sure they are of English stock and not some foreign mix?

    “Same with NYC, where I live. The more I travel the more I realize the best looking girls, despite the fatties, are in America and parts of Western Europe. ”

    Looks are just one part of the equation. You rather date a masculine, ball-busting 8 than a feminine, pleasing 6.5/7? And be honest: how many of those hottie NYC chicks have you gotten? You pull hotter in NYC than eastern europe? So why are you still there? There must be other advantages which keep you there, are there not?

    “They are kind of sexy in a feminine kind of way. For myself, I categorize them as “3 beer” girls. They look good after 3 beers. ”

    I can somewhat agree with this. Poland has a ton of 6 and 7s, but past the makeup and lighting there isn’t more 8s than say NYC/Miami. Again, I don’t think a man can ask for much more than a 7 who worships him.

    “Roosh, that you would attribute so much value to looks and money, which you have been doing more and more of late. You seem to be losing some of your faith, at least, in game.”

    Really?

    http://www.rooshv.com/getting-laid-while-unemployed-and-living-in-your-dads-basement

    As for looks/logistics, I urge guys to leverage their strengths, whether it’s their looks or what have you:

    http://www.rooshv.com/your-duty-as-a-man

    To urge guys just to use “game” in shitty cities while they’re overweight and unsightly is retarded. There are many factors that lead to sexual success, and it’s my job to discuss them all.

    Money is only a factor if it helps with logistics (putting you in a centrally located apartment in a nice city, for example). But having stacks of cash alone in your pocket without the other factors is useless, as a lot of rich guys can attest to.

  • Watchman

    @George2

    Obviously this is a hugely subjective subject, but I pretty much disagree with everything you said. I’ve spent time in NY, Miami and West coast US and pretty women are rare. I barely saw a hot girl in 6 months. What I did see was lots of badly dressed fatsos.

    I lived in London 5 years, and it’s better, but most of the best looking women there are foreigners.

    What all those places have are groups of expensively decked out women with bitchy attitudes. I get the impression that’s your thing, and that’s cool if you like it. Most guys can’t stand those types of women, including me.

    Underneath their glam, most are average. What they are great for is an ego boost. If they are mean to everyone else and nice to you, then you must be good. Been there, done that, it’s boring. Give me a hot girl from Thailand or Eastern Europe any day.

  • Anon

    “Manhattan girls are much more masculine and intense, but much, much prettier.”

    George2,

    Manhattan is a worldwide draw, which is why there are hotter girls in Manhattan than compared to some random Eastern European country.

    I echo Roosh’s thought: if you’re banging hot Manhattan babes, why the fuck do you care about what other chicks halfway across the world look like?

    You’re probably the typical, semi-neutered Manhattan dude who is content just merely looking at hot chicks.

    If you’re fucking them, then you’d truly realize how much of a turn-off it is to be with masculine chicks, no matter how hot.

  • George2

    Roosh, that’s just the thing, you’re meeting low class English girls backpacking in foreign countries. When I lived in Thailand, that’s all I met too, and I formed my impression of English girls based on them.

    But I said where I met the sweet feminine English girls – London. They certainly looked like white English girls, and they spoke with flawless English accents, but I can’t say definitively if they are of English stock. But they were certainly culturally English.

    The nasty English girls you describe certainly exist – and in larger numbers than in Eastern Europe – but they are not the norm for middle class and upper class English women who live in London.

    You say that you heard too many reports about how bad English girls are. So did I. That’s why London was such an eye opener.

    As for the looks/femininity equation, I couldn’t agree with you more. You are quite right – femininity and sweetness are hugely important to me, and I would much rather be with a cure 7 – even a very cute 6 – who is sweet and demure than a ball busting 8. Hands down.

    But I will not claim that the cute 7 is a 9 or a 10 just because she is feminine. Eastern European women have enormous advantages over American girls in terms of demeanor, but they are not as hot.

    Guys who are not honest about the hotness of women are a pet peeve of mine. Maybe all a guy can get is a 6 who’s sweet, maybe that’s even what he wants, but it’s too common for guys to make judgments based on their egos.

    I actually plan on leaving Kiev soon because it is not the paradise I expected. As for my success in Manhattan, it is obviously not spectacular (though by no means shameful, either), which is precisely the reason I came to Kiev. I thought I’d be banging Manhattan quality girls with much greater ease. Well, Kiev girls are much easier than Manhattan girls, and much more feminine, but much less attractive as well.

    This is depressing to me because I am reluctantly realizing that you can’t have it all in life – either Manhattan hotness or femininity, apparently not both. I wanted both. Sure me for being a dreamer.

    The new dream might just have to be a 7 who worships me – not a bad dream at all.

    But still, it seems that the correct conclusion according to game theory would be that if a hot girl is with an ugly dude with no money, that dude’s got game, no? The inference you draw in this post seems to not quite be in accordance with game theory, although it is a very interesting post nonetheless. Maybe one can say if that an ugly dude with no money AND no game – or a whole country of such guys – is with a hot girl then the situation is simply skewed in favor of guys and against girls. Thusly tweaked, the theory makes total sense, but I am not entirely sure how one could verify a lack of game in a country’s men.

    And I am not saying you have completely given up on game, but some of your recent posts seem to suggest to me a weakening of your belief in it. For instance, you used to dismiss good dress as having any importance, yet you recently posted completely different thoughts on the subject. You’ve definitely grown much less emphatic about the efficacy of pure game as opposed to other factors. Not necessarily a bad or even wrong thing, but something worth noting.

  • Rakishness

    @67 Cosign College Park being a bad place to game. Colleges should have at least a 60/40 W to F ratio or you shouldn’t attend. Lol

  • George2

    Watchman, it is not entirely clear if you dislike American girls because they aren’t so hot or if you dislike them because of their attitude. Even though you mention that you rarely saw a beauty in America, the latter part of your post suggests it is the attitude that really bothers you, and you are confusing the two issues.

    I agree with you completely about the attitude, and might well sacrifice looks myself for sweet femininity, but it is a pet peeve of mine when guys confuse the two issues and can’t keep the the two streams of thought separate in their heads. Let us be brutally honest with ourselves.

    I’m not saying definitively that you did confuse the two issues, but your words suggest that you might have.

  • George2

    Anon, I said it already, but I’ll say it again. Masculine girls suck. I agree.It’s a shame, though, that we can’t have Manhattan level hotness with femininity and sweetness (Wouldn’t we all like that? )And it’s a shame when guys confuse the two issues in their heads.

  • Anonymous

    @george2
    I read a book called”How to Date Young Women for Men Over 35″ sorry the authors name slips my mind since its been a while since I read it, however,he breaks down women on how they are perceived by society+ not his own opinion of them.
    and other things which I wanted to relate that he says is that he found that a good 7 was all one needed because a 7 knows she isnt a supermodel but with some make-up and some nice clothes etc..will be bumped up a point more or 2 in looks.
    a 7 he stated can also be a better person as far as attitude compared to a 8-10 who probably had her looks since puberty and was used and abused because of it by horny men(step dad,next door nieghbor,etc..hence the shitty attitude and hatered for men found in hotter chicks…thats kinda where im at with where i feel I want a women to be.roosh I read your 1-10 scale,etc..and I still think that a good 7 knows her place in this world,+will usually have a better personality because “looks” wasnt something a 7 thinks will get her by in the world.unlike a 8-10.anyways its a no brainer.less headache.we’re all different in what we want in a women I suppose.

  • Anon

    @ George2,

    I find east Euro girls hot, and so do most guys.

    8, 9 or 10 whatevs. I do them all, including the ocassional 6.

  • Eurotrash

    Yeah, this is something I have been observing for a while. Or at least since I’ve moved to America and could compare.

    My story: I’m a Slovakian guy who moved to USA at the age 24 for internship after college and then stayed here. I was married to an American girl for about 5 years, but surprise, surprise, it didn’t work out and got divorced over a year ago. Being single and lost on US dating scene (I met my exwife very soon after coming here and basically never dated in USA before). Found game and worked on myself a little bit, better style, gym, etc, you know the drill. Got some decent results here in Arizona. Fortunatelly, I live in Scottsdale, AZ, and most girls don’t look too bad, at least compared to other places in USA, girls generally try to look after themselves, keep in shape, etc, but personality-wise they are the standard fare of entitled princess bitches for the most part.
    Then, last summer I went for a month long vacation back to Slovakia, my first visit back home after 7 years. About a month before my trip I started pipelining girls online so I have somebody already waiting there. The ad was not clever at all, just to the point, basically saying something about me and listing requirements for the woman, and I mass mailed the same generic intro message to all the girls I was interested in. And the difference from my earlier American online results was already staggering. Positive reply rate of about 30% (note that all were girls 7.5+, at least from their pic). 2 girls replied something along the lines that they are a little chubby (their pic looked good though) and that I probably won’t like them since I’m looking for a sporty girl (imagine AW disqualifying herself like this, ain’t gonna happen). Anyways, pipelined many more girls than I could actually meet since I had a busy schedule visiting family and old friends. Banged a few hotties this way, they all fell for me fast and hard. All educated, hot, good girls. One even came to vist me here in AZ later that year, on her own expense of course.
    However, USA probably gave me the incentive to actually work on myself. Dating market is quite tough here for men. Compared to this was picking up girls in Slovakia like taking candy from a child. Incredible difference. But while i lived there I never knew how good we had it. Now I’m torn; I have a good career, income, comfortable life here, but the chicks are just so much better “over there”.

  • Eurotrash

    “If a guy dates up, his game is good. If a guy dates down, his game sucks.”

    Roosh: In America, sure. In Eastern Europe it says little.

    Yeah, when I lived in Slovakia I was as chodey as it gets for the most part and still managed to get really hot girls. There were some naturals, but most guys didn’t really have game. You just didn’t really need it, dating scene was more “normal”.
    However, interesting fact: I know many Czech/Slovak expats girls living here and their general opinion of American men is quite low, they say that they are either boring or players. This does make sense actually; my opinion is that the dating market in USA is just very unhealthy, FUBAR. Seduction community certainly didn’t make things better, but you can’t blame the guys, they are just adapting to changing environment. The real underlying reason is rise of feminism, obesity epidemic and consequent falling standards of American females.
    Will be interesting to see how this spirals out in the end…

  • Vic

    Solid post. Brazil is on my list, thanks to you, Roosh.

    As for Rob in Cambodia, you’ll be swamped with local pussy, but it’ll cost ya. They’re poor – dirt poor, and they are looking for a sugar daddy.

  • http://oldsystemwillfall.wordpress.com Nestorius

    Roosh,
    I keep wondering about one thing: how are you able to fund yourself for all those travels?
    I have traveled a lot and I know how traveling costs especially if you are living there.

  • Renan

    I’m a brazilian man and I live in Rio and I don’t know where you’ve seen these busted dudes.
    The rich part of Rio (South Zone, where you were) is mostly inhabited by caucasian european descendents (Portuguese, Italian and Spanish), which are quite good looking men, and they’re the ones getting the babes.
    You just lost a few points with me on this one.

  • InterestedParty

    I keep saying it, but ratio is the MOST important thing. Period.

    Keep learning game. It’s great for confidence and will help you in many ways besides getting laid.

    But strictly speaking, being in a place where there are more women than guys is FAR, FAR more important (to getting laid). Hell, like you said, you get chicks with ZERO game when the numbers are in your favor.

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  • Ivan Durak

    Roosh: about Russia and Ukraine, one should realize that while the general population is not rich, the capitals are where most of the well paid and rich live. So in Moscow, and Kiev but to a lesser extent, being decked out in something more expensive than Hugo Boss is sort of a minimum to regularly meet (not get) 8s. Money’s not required to seduce them (power is), but being poor means you won’t get to meet these girls and you wont be able to follow their lifestyle (many have friends or boyfriends who pay for everything, from handbags to cars and appartments).

    And the situation in the smaller towns is not much better: all the pretty girls flee the country side and want to make it in the big city. Exception made for a few regional cities with good universities or with rich industries (thus rich parents, thus ex-model mothers etc).

  • Anonymous

    My experience with Eastern Europe consists of travel to Ukraine and Russia. I found a difference between the two countries.

    Ukraine the women are slim and feminine. Their attractiveness is slightly above western average , but poor nutrition gives their faces blemishes and dark spots. Did not like their mindsets , in that they were real schemers. Be careful! Up to 2007 they were getting really full of themselves and increasingly difficult and flakey. Lots of foreigners from Western Europe and Turkey etc fished out this pool. Now, after the crash it’s a different story. ( hmm .. lessen to be learned there ? )

    Now Russia on the other hand.. Wow! way above average looks , had me shaking my head. Being in bigger cities far from Moscow the streets were brimming with attractive young stylish girls. Attitude was superior too. But, you gotta be somewhat stylish yourself and have masculine game.

    Don’t agree with the poster that said the big cities have high income . Yes, more people have high income , but still the average wage is not that much higher than the typical EE $500 month max.

  • Brian

    Hi #94 Anonymous
    Interested what you said. I was in Ukraine many times from 2004 to 2007. Enjoyed myself but had assumed that the dating game was hopeless because of the explosion of dating dating sites and me going there.

    So are you saying things have gotten a lot better after the economic correction. And which place do you prefore the women, Ukraine or Russia now. Which place is easier to get laid or get a girl friend.

  • Brian

    Hi @94 Anonymous

    (I posted this a second time to correct all the mispellings and make it read better)
    Interested what you said. I was in Ukraine many times from 2004 to 2007. Enjoyed myself but had assumed that the dating game was becoming worse because of the explosion of dating dating sites and men going there.

    Are you saying things have gotten a lot better after the economic correction in 2007? Which place do you prefer the women, Ukraine or Russia now? Which place is easier to get laid or get girl friends?

  • kobmaster

    Dude this is technically one of your best posts ever. You are introducing a “technical formula” resulting from your street smart observations and experiences. That’s excellent work.

  • Noah

    Some shitty posts like Gross and Woodbridge-both clearly unattractive females that by some miracle still attract attention thx to the dating mess we live in today’s world…lots of good posts tho too many to name here-#50 you are straight on point-same shit here in London 6s masquerading as 9s it is truly absurd-struggling lately and I’m a handsome guy-gota gtfo of here!

  • Worldmusic

    I did a graduate program for a year in Scotland in 2008. The dollar tanked that year and I was broke, not that money matters when your gaming chicks, but it destroyed my self esteem and made me preoccupied with paying tuition and surviving. Plus, Scotland is packed with international students from around the world (the EU encourages students to cross borders). Also, lots of Alphas from Africa and Latin America, so being African American did not make me exotic in the least. Well, it was a terrible year (4 & 5′s from Italy being treated like they were 9′s by local Scots! How quickly they forgot!) It was really bad, until I started going to these all Polish parties given by Polish students. I think times are tough over in Poland, because these people partied hard like they wanted to forget, and hooked up like nothing. No one was a 10, but neither am I. I was just happy to be finally getting laid.

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  • C LLMMCCLL

    I have to credit Roosh with solid logic here. I lived overseas at (yeah, like I’m going to tell guys where the goldmine is) and you could throw a rock in the air and hit a hot chick who would date you because you were American. That scene changed pretty quick when Americans overran the place- as it always does. Lived there for over a year, returned and thought, ‘why do these damned chicks think they’re anything? They’re angry, ugly bitches compared to most women in Europe. WTF?!’

    They still are. American women are ruined for the most part. Yeah, there are a few spots here and there to find a hot one who isn’t insane (i.e. spoiled princess), but that pond grows smaller all the time.

  • Dan

    On the other hand in eastern europe you’ll see goodlooking guys with ugly girls (they are execptions of course), because that’ll that can afford. It’s all about money and status in easten europe, much more than it is in western world where women can feed theselves. Get real buddy. Whitout money and/or status (americam citizenship in your case) a man is worth nothing in the eyes of an eastern european woman.

  • Marsha

    This all makes perfect sense, in Trinidad, men are spoiled for choice and a lot of women are beginning to realise that foreign men, especially from the US and UK tend to treat us better and appreciate us more that the locals.

  • JG

    I’m also an ENTP with a few years dedicated to gaming. I came up with a different system that has been fairly accurate so far – I look at the profiles of local prostitutes, as compared to how much they charge compared to an average days wages in that country for a blue collar worker. Usually, prostitutes that rate about 6.5 will charge approximately 120% of the average blue collar (ie construction worker) daily wage for an hours service. If you see prostitutes that are hotter than 6.5 charging less than 120% of a daily wage in any specific city, then you know that that city has a surplus of hot women. The greater the variation, the greater the ratio difference. I presently live in a place where prostitutes charge 150% of the average wage, and are 5s or worse. There is no sense in gaming here at all, because no matter how disgusting the girl is, theres always some desperado willing to pay her rent. Whenever I leave this place on vacation, I clean up. The only thing to be done in this place is snipe tourists before they’re swamped

  • Anonymous

    @ JG

    Where are you from? Cause your system definitely does not work in some regions. It also greatly depends on which class of prostitutes you are talking about.

    In Bangkok, the average construction worker wage per day is ~270 baht ($9). The cheapest low quality pro you can find will cost you 500 baht, which is 185% of the average wage. Now, for the middle range pros, a normal price is 1500 baht, 555% of the construction worker wage. This tells nothing about “gaming” the normal girls.

    As you can see here, the dynamics varies so much by region. It probably works where you’re from, but not in BKK as an example.

  • http://kaneadvice.wordpress.com Kane

    @JG
    Good idea.

    I came up with the idea of using prostitute attractiveness as a measure of how accessible quality pussy was in that city/country etc.
    e.g. even in a country with attractive women, prostitutes will be ugly if the regular women don’t put out.

  • HT

    Doesn’t work where I’m from here in Amsterdam. Haha. Dutch girls are nothing special.

  • Travstrong

    Loving the scientific approach, I’m wondering is there even deeper that you can go, looking at the CIA world factbook entries for life expectancies per gender, I notice that in countries such as Russia, Brazil, Ukraine and Poland, the difference in life expectancies between the genders is pretty high, a whole 11 years for Ukraine for example, 8 for Brazil and Poland and 12 for Russia, might explain things a bit, less men = surplus of women = better looking women favoured over ugly ones. Perhaps there is a tipping point in this life expectancy difference that results in the effects you mention.

  • Beach

    How about Hartford, Connecticut? You guys say DC is bad, and all the guys here rave about DC like the chicks are all models. I’d like to know if anyone can succeed consistently in central CT

    Thinking maybe I’d use the Denmark tactics, but I’m not sure if it’s quite the same.

  • sane atheist

    try vietnam i went there a few weeks ago very high percentage of attractive girls with amazing figures i would walk down the street at ho chi mihn city and groups of girls would ask to talk a photo of me with them then offer to join me shopping. easiest place to get laid with quality women (if you are tall)

  • Daniel

    I used to get jealous as well. Then I started to wonder how they got those women. The most common story was timing. In some cases they met the women young and wifed them. In other cases they caught them at a certain moment, usually when the woman was going through a self-esteem crisis, then got in and stayed in.

  • Anonymous

    I like this test because it really hits home to my city of Toronto.

    I have mutliple friends, not just 1, but many, who traded down. 1 of them even has decent game. Still traded down.

    The big problem is that many of those guys don’t even think they traded down!

    As they say in that movie American Beauty “Never underestimate the power of denial”

    One of my closest friends is a decent looking guy and a CGA, he has a nice future. Tall, 6 4″ brown hair, I asked my sisters and they said he was good looking.

    But when I met his girlfriend, well this is kind of sad, she was ugly. She wasn’t even avg. Not a 5 or 6, but I think more like a 2 or 3.

    When ever I’m around him I keep hearing him call her “Beautiful”, all the time, beautiful, beautiful. I feel kind of strange to my stomach.

    Thats Toronto. It’s depressing.

  • not-found

    What about Scotland, anyone have any specific info on Edinbrough or other areas?

    Is the country side better for the busted dudes test?

  • Correcter

    Why would an experienced PUA like Roosh think that looks of men matter?

    Women don’t get turned on (or off!) by looks. That’s why you see ugly men with pretty women. Women, who have a lot of choice, have chosen an ugly man. If looks mattered, that would -never- happen!

    You don’t see men, who have a lot of choice, selecting ugly women. That’s because women’s looks matter.

    It’s the STATUS that is the key to a woman’s choice. If man has status, woman’s sexuality will turn on and start pulsing and throbbing. If man doesn’t, it will turn off and dry and fall into deep coma.

    Status simply means ‘man’s place in hierarchy between men, in a way that’s important for women’s sexuality’.

    The ugliest possible outlaw biker will always get beautiful women, as much as he ever wants, in pretty much ANY country (except where such women don’t exist, of course).

    The most handsome and good-looking, shy, bumbling, silent, introvert Linux-nerd who lives with his mom, has no ambition, money, plans for the future or the courage to buy his own underwear, let alone look women in the eyes, will not get laid, no matter how good his looks are. He might get approached a bit, but when the women realize he has no status of any kind, that will be the end of that.

    What I don’t get is that PUAs should already know that it’s the PUA-skills that forms the status that they use to attract women – it’s the confidence, the humor, all those traits that tell of a high status that draws the women in, NOT their looks!

    It doesn’t matter if you are uglier than a hole in the ground, or a Brad Pitt-lookalike – it’s the status that will be the key in whether women will crowd or avoid you.

    PUA-skill set is a manifestation of status. And yet PUAs still think that looks matter?

    What’s wrong with this picture?

  • guy in poland

    Most of these comments are surprisingly far off. 114 is the first to be on the right track. The difference between the west and the east, rich and poor, is that the status of men is measured differently. In poor countries affluence is much more important than looks. While in a welfare state like the Nordic countries everybody is pretty well off so women hardly care about money, only other status factors and looks. And it’s not because eastern European girls are money hungry whores, it’s because a large part of their existence is centered around their fear of poverty. Eastern European countries are also incredibly homogeneous which means the social structures are more rigid and less dynamic. Here you still have an idea of the upper class being more cultured and educated (hence the importance put on education) while in America it’s all about success and fame. Here a though guy is gangster that will straight up kill you for scraps, his lifestyle is not idolized like famous gangsters are in America through rap music and such. So the american style alpha male prancing around with an attitude will not be considered attractive in more cultured circles, he still will have success with the ‘less cultured’ broad public which is more influenced by Hollywood. Of course this doesn’t mean there’s an alpha male prototype here he just looks and acts differently and his existence is concentrated to smaller social circles.

  • guy in poland

    And I also want to add, the whole concept of an american looking woman is kind useless as there is no such thing. Americans are immigrants from mostly different parts of Europe only a few generations back that then have mixed to a varying extent. Only in style and attitude will there be a noticeable ‘American look’. However personally i often appreciate the physical results these mixed couples produce, especially with south american blood. In Poland for example you almost never see this as everybody is a white Polish Catholic.

  • Gaylord

    If one had to choose the best and most important post out of everything Roosh has written in the last decade, this would be the one.

  • Anon

    Well what’s her personality like? Even the most handsome/beautiful people can be ugly with a bad attitude/dud personality. Likewise with people who are average and below, a shining personality and a great attitude can make someone infinitely more attractive. So maybe, she IS beautiful to him and you’re just so concerned with surface looks, you can’t see it.

  • Joe

    I notice one thing that can help a guy in a country like Spain or Italy where both sexes are equally good looking is height. I have been traveling to Spain for the last six years, one thing I notice about local Spanish men is that many tend to be on the shorter side. I am a bit over 6 feet tall, around 6-1, whenever I am in Spain I always feel taller than a lot of men, and in many places women notice it. I have a tan complexion and a Mediterranean look, I can easily pass for a Spaniard, but I tend to be a lot taller than most Spanish guys.
    Women definitely notice me, and that makes the approach fairly easy. I would agree the Eastern European countries you mentioned are good places to date “up”.
    The Scandinavian countries are by far the worst places for a guy. Germany can be good or bad, there are a lot of Eastern European and Turkish immigrant women in Germany, I found them to be very easily approachable.

  • Joe

    My family came over from Italy, but many girls of my background, I consider them more American than Italian. I always notice a difference between Italians in Italy and those in America. Women from Eastern Europe are very different from those who grew up in America. I know a Hungarian women who has been in the US for over a decade, while she is attractive and well kept physically, mentally she is very much like an American woman. She has some really crazy attitudes, she considers herself a good “Christian” yet works as a prostitute, has sex with a lot of men. Despite the fact that she is basically a slut, she expects the men she is with to be complete gentlemen with her. A girl like this would be put out of normal society back in Hungary and condemned as a whore but not in America.
    I have noticed a big difference in the women that live in Italy versus Italian-American women. I prefer those in Italy by a big margin.

  • Dan

    You overestimate how much girls actually care about looks. It matters to a certain degree, but if you’re dumb or not raking in a decent income, expect to strike out 99% of the time when it comes to chicks you’d wanna “wife up.”

  • OG

    East Germany used to be a great place for GI’s. maybe not any more. I had girls there undressing me with their eyes all the time when I was stationed in Berlin and went to East Berlin. Of course, i was younger and hotter then :-)

  • SUPRA luca

    Nope, it’s just that a lot of guys like you want to believe women don’t care too much about looks because you are ugly. Stop there.
    Women do care a lot about looks. If you are sweet with a good personality, okay, you can look a little bit uglier, but it’s better if you don’t and that only matters if they want to be in a relationship; for dating around it is only looks and knowing you are not a psycopath or rapist. Intelligence is relative, but I guess everyone wants someone you can talk to. Most women today don’t care about you income – as long as you have one, that is okay.

  • SUPRA luca

    Nope, it’s just that a lot of guys like you want to believe women don’t care too much about looks because you are ugly. Stop there.
    Women do care a lot about looks. If you are sweet with a good personality, okay, you can look a little bit uglier, but it’s better if you don’t and that only matters if they want to be in a relationship; for dating around it is only looks and knowing you are not a psycopath or rapist. Intelligence is relative, but I guess everyone wants someone you can talk to. Most women today don’t care about you income – as long as you have one, that is okay.