3 Lessons From The Confrontation Between Burt Reynolds And Marc Summers

On October 17, 1994, Burt Reynolds and Marc Summers appeared on The Tonight Show with Jay Leno. They proceeded to have an altercation that turned out to be a case study of what happens when a man is confronted by another who is more alpha. I recommend you watch the below video first, read my analysis, and then re-watch it to catch anything you missed.

Analysis of the confrontation

Burt came on as the first guest to promote his new book. After his interview with Leno, Marc was announced as the second guest. Marc glided through the stage with spirited confidence. He shook Leno’s hand and then made a noticeable swallow when he shook Burt’s. Already, there is fear, which was reportedly due to the fact that Marc had previously made jokes about Burt’s divorce habit. I suspect that Marc did not plan on ever seeing Burt in such close quarters.

As the interview with Leno begins, Marc contorts his body away from Burt’s, as if hoping he will somehow disappear. He also crosses his legs, which is usually the body’s way of seeking comfort. Burt then makes some kind of noise or movement at 1:13 that catches Marc’s attention. He looks over to see what is going on. Burt takes that as an opportunity to insert himself into the conversation.

Marc re-adjusts his body language to accommodate Burt, but quickly goes back to facing Leno with legs crossed in the hope that Burt doesn’t interrupt again. That hope is dashed. Burt interrupts Marc to criticize his distant body language. Marc immediately adjusts his body to please Burt and his dominant frame. Marc then obediently answers two of Burt’s questions before catching his own subservience. He feels inferior and attempts to re-assert dominance by patting Burt on the back while making a joke about the fact that Burt is going through a divorce.

Burt does not submit to Marc’s frame by responding with a verbal insult of his own. Instead, he escalates the situation by dumping a mug of water onto Marc’s lap. Marc is shocked yet tries to laugh it off, and then attempts to splash Burt with a mug of water, but Burt is too quick and blocks the incoming attack, causing both the mug and water to impact Marc’s face. There is a flash at 1:54 where you can see Marc expressing genuine fear. He quickly recomposes himself and tries to show apathy by smiling while Burt continues to sit stone-faced as if nothing abnormal is going on.

Shock and fear on Marc Summers’ face

Burt then leans over and makes a threatening gesture with his hands. Marc shows a sign of submission by separating his hands instead of adopting a defensive posture. It has gone too far for him. Judging by his stunned reaction and high-pitched nervous laughter, I wouldn’t be surprised if this was the most violent encounter that he had ever experienced in his life.

At 2:18, Marc reaches for another mug but stops himself upon realizing that Burt will likely retaliate. He gets tongue-tied, repeatedly saying “you know” until finally getting his sentence out. Burt remains calm. Not yet done with his fun, Burt pats Marc on the hand to display dominance. Without looking back at Burt, Marc says “Don’t touch me” in a serious tone. Perhaps realizing he has gone too far, Burt says he’s “Sorry.” Marc takes advantage of the apology by facing Burt and asking him a question to control the frame. Burt does not take the bait.

Burt soaks in the absurdity of the situation by reclining far back on his seat and laughing. Marc takes the opportunity to splash Burt with a third mug of water (3:04). Marc then immediately turns his back on Burt, as if he wanted to run away. Burt does not physically escalate, but jokes that he slept with Marc’s wife. Marc’s response to being called a cuckold was to appeal to Burt’s kindness. It doesn’t work, and then Marc insults Burt and his inability to get regular work.

Burt gave Marc an opportunity to retaliate

To capitalize on the drama, the show’s producers set up a cream pie duel. The two men start with their backs to each other. Leno begins the count to three. Burt, ever the scoundrel, launches his pie at the count of 2.5 with great force, landing a direct hit on Marc’s face. The impact was so strong that Marc took several pitty-pat steps backwards out of fear that additional blows would rain down upon him. Burt gets weakly hit by Marc’s pie at a glancing angle and responds with a devilish smirk.

Marc is dissatisfied with the duel and considers launching a sneak attack from behind, but again, fear causes him to hesitate. He almost slips on the floor. It’s clear that Marc senses he has been disproportionately attacked. He strains for ways to get even.

Burt, feeling his opponent’s humiliation, extends a sign of submission by hugging Marc, which is quickly accepted. Marc then experiences a surge of confidence and accepts another cream pie that was handed to him, but hesitates at the crucial moment.

The mood becomes more light-hearted as Burt helps clean Marc off, but he can’t resist giving one final display of dominance by pulling Marc towards him from behind (6:33). Marc appears happy that the embarrassment is over.

Burt shows dominance by thrusting Marc from behind

Three lessons we can learn from Burt and Marc’s confrontation

1. Confidence can only be faked until the unexpected happens

Marc, a veteran television personality, seemed confident and polished when his name was first announced. He was displaying a fake, learned confidence, something he is able to turn on when a camera is pointed at him, but as soon as he encountered a novel situation that diverged from his previous experiences, he reacted in a way that reflected his baseline levels of fear, anxiety, and submissiveness.

Burt also responded emotionally, as his water toss was clearly spur-of-the-moment. While both men are famous in their own right, one possessed a higher level of natural confidence that allowed him to dominate another man in a spontaneous encounter that neither of them had prepared for. By not submitting to the frame of a clearly more dominant man, Marc lost the battle and had to endure public humiliation.

2. If you give your enemy an inch, he will take a mile

The wolf on the right does not intend to put up a fight

The only three instances that Marc felt a surge of confidence was when Burt showed submission signs by apologizing, lowering his physical defenses by reclining on the couch, and offering a hug. Each time, Marc used the submission signal to retaliate. Luckily for Burt, Marc was too beta to successfully complete his counter-attacks.

Paradoxically, Burt’s signs of submission actually made him appear more human. Going for the jugular on national television, which he could have easily done, may have led to a public relations nightmare. Either Burt stopped short to not be perceived as a bully, or he is not the ultimate alpha, and could be defeated in a battle with a man who would not so easily show submission signals.

While Burt’s submissions played well on television since the scorecard was so heavily tilted in his favor, real-life encounters must be approached more cold-heartedly. If you don’t completely destroy or incapacitate your enemy, you merely give him an opening to take you down. It’s not wise to enter any confrontation unless you’re prepared to go all the way.

3. Don’t assume someone with more status (money, fame, women, etc.) is more alpha than you.

Even though Burt was the first guest on the show, he wasn’t doing well at the time. He just lost the love of his life, was having money problems, and as Marc implied, was having trouble getting movie roles. Objectively, Marc was doing better, but material success only weakly correlates to male dominance. In fact, it could be the case that the more financially successful a man is, the more likely he had to submit to other more powerful men in order to achieve his station. This becomes quite literal in the sexual sense with Hollywood actors, who agree to be sodomized for a chance at fame.

You can’t buy or win your way into alpha. Famous beta males like Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk, Anthony Bourdain, and Aziz Ansari clearly show that. Assuming you are not born alpha, which most men aren’t, you can achieve it only by unlocking it internally through your belief system and mental framework. Until you understand yourself, face your fears, and neutralize your anxieties, you won’t be able to properly size up or face your enemies.

Conclusion

Who’s the boss?

This encounter is a microcosm of how men of different power levels interact in day-to-day life. While most interactions don’t involve mugs of water or cream pies, a careful observer can pick out dozens of signs of submission and dominance in the most banal of conversations between men. It’s rather easy to appear dominant in calm and predictable scenarios, but when things get raw and spontaneous, like it did for Marc Summers and Burt Reynolds, the only strength that gets displayed is what’s already within you.

Read Next: “My Way” Is The Most Masculine Song Ever Created

Related Posts For You

80
Leave a Reply

Please Login to comment
avatar
  
smilegrinwinkmrgreenneutraltwistedshockunamusedcooleviloopsrazzrollcryeeklolmadsadexclamationquestionideahmmbegwhewchucklesillyenvyshutmouth
37 Comment threads
43 Thread replies
3 Followers
 
Most reacted comment
Hottest comment thread
51 Comment authors
Anti-GnosticReaderSkeptic of rooshDDDDuanewpuser11114 Recent comment authors
newest oldest most voted
Clark Kent
Guest
Clark Kent
Offline

Solid article

Lester
Guest
Lester
Offline

Book an appointment with H aley B lumenfeld. She is one of the sexist women in Toronto. You would be a homosexual to not see her:

P.S.: I’m not an undercover CSIS agent attempting to entrap radicalized men who use “Men’s Rights Activist” or neo-Nazi forums.

Vortac
Guest
Vortac
Offline
Rara
Guest
Rara
Offline

Useles Alfa Beta bullshit, no one cares about this shit any more. Freaking burt reynolds, lol

Socrates
Guest
Socrates
Offline

he still did a lot better than your mistyped, lazy and worthless 2 line bullshit comment. A well written short essay is always better than a lazy/bullshit statement that explains or teaches nothing.

bjtucker5
Guest
bjtucker5
Offline

Find a echo chamber that suits you better. Gtfoh

Socrates
Guest
Socrates
Offline

by the way, the fallacy you people make, is called: ‘appeal to novelty’. Find an ‘echo chamber’ that suits you better, and ‘gtfpoh’ yourself , you little and stupid shit wink

D B
Guest
D B
Offline

What is being left out of the analysis is image management and impulsivity/anger control. Also Reynolds was known to be an alcohol abuser and he may have had some in his system and thus been relatively disinhibited. The person who appears ‘beta’ may just feel that they have more to lose by losing control. I think this alpha/beta dichotomy might apply more to schoolyard brawls but adulthood contains a number of realities that favour self-control/diplomacy over acting out. I understand the analysis from the POV of which behaviors are more alpha but then we should concede that alpha doesn’t always produce the best outcome. For example, it might be alpha to tell you boss to shove his written evaluation of you up his ass but if it gets you fired in a tough job market and you have a family to support, is your wife going soak her panties bc you acted all alpha?

Aaron
Guest
Aaron
Offline

Good points

Anti-Gnostic
Guest
Anti-Gnostic
Offline

“What is being left out of the analysis is image management and impulsivity/anger control. ”

Exactly. The fact of the matter is that Reynolds acted like a gamma.

Summers came with a whimsical confidence and, having had previously faced similar experiences as a standup comic, promptly asserted himself with a mocking attitude toward Bert. Summers made the comment about being married to prod Bert. Rather than not take the bait, Bert reacted in a way reflective of a fading star with a myriad of difficulties–physically escalate matters.

Reynolds demanded, not expected, to be an active part of Marc’s interview, and he became easily offended when Summers, who was showing respect for the host accordingly by crossing his legs and adjusting his body language. Burt’s “frame” was one of a little boy who wanted even more attention from his parents, even though they had coddled him previously. Remember, Reynolds was given two segments. Apparently, Reynolds was acting like a complete prick to everyone that night though, as he awkwardly cut off Jay Leno’s tie during his own interview a few minutes before.

So by escalating matters through a sophomoric prank–throwing water into Summer’s lap–Reynolds clearly puts himself in gamma territory thereafter with his prancing and posturing. Had Reynolds cooly interjected with subtle but jovial digs as Summer’s interview progressed, Reynolds would have shown the world that, despite his problems, he still commanded a presence. Instead, the public deservedly tore into Reynolds for his juvenile behavior.

Zarathoustra
Guest
Zarathoustra
Offline

Great analysis.

Subversion
Guest
Subversion
Offline

Wasn’t Burt a homo in Boogie Nights or at very least helped to fuel the gay porno agenda in that movie….? I’m gunna say Burt is like a pseudo faggy pornstar wanna be alpha here.

Anti-Gnostic
Guest
Anti-Gnostic
Offline

LOL. No, Burt played the director of hetero porn. Next time, bone up on your movie knowledge, rather than limp in.

Subversion
Guest
Subversion
Offline

OH Hey was JUST playing a porno director…oh okay, so its ALL GOOD then???…LMFAO!

Aye Jay
Guest
Aye Jay
Offline

It could be said that all porn is homosexual. Why watch another man have his way with a woman? You can’t seperate the two…you’ll have that image in your mind for a long time…

Anti-Gnostic
Guest
Anti-Gnostic
Offline

“It could be said that all porn is homosexual.”

What an insane thing to say.

Winters
Guest
Winters
Offline

Seems like not real alpha behavior though. Sure he got taunted but its like why reply to the child drama in the first place? “I’m still married as a matter of fact.” And the crowd starts to laugh so Burt ‘punishes him’ by throwing water on him, but in reality why would you even reply to that? There’s no point. He basically is simply ‘one-uping’ the bad behavior, its not real alpha actually. Would’ve been a lot more badass if he just said, “Do you talk like that to everyone?” – and then maybe insert “No wonder you work for Nickelodeon” or something along those lines if you wanna verbally jab back. Go full physical isn’t alpha behavior, its illusionary alpha. He can get away with it in this pussy society cuse he’s talking to a dude whose retarded but no physical alpha behavior in nature goes unpunished. Its an illusion more than anything else.

The subconscious thinks “oh its alpha” cuse he’s doing something which would warrant a death sentence in nature AND he survived the physical altercation, but in reality [i.e. in nature] he wouldn’t attempt that or escalate so quick unless it really warranted it. Granted his reputation was sort of on the line, but an actual alpha in nature would be able to easily brush off something so incredibly juvenile. If he had replied, “Do you talk like to everyone ?” then suddenly the guy would have to back track and justify his behavior to the entire room.

The point is you treat beta’s like you do women, and do you give women that time of day the same as you do this idiot guy? No. Replace this beta with a girl, and the girl says the exact same thing, “I’m still married as a matter of fact.” – What would Burt do then? Would he toss water on the girl for insulting him….lmao, never. That’s the real alpha situation to be deciphered here. But you only physically altercate or need too if the other guy is actually a worthy opponent, this ‘man’ is not, its like a knight dueling a jester, it’s under his paygrade to even engage. I realize the common wannabe alphas here will say he was protecting his reputation but the fact of the matter is this little guy wasn’t enough to destroy Burt’s reputation in the first place.

Neo
Guest
Neo
Offline

Burt was the alpha. The other guy looked like a fucking bitch.

This literally looked like a jock picking on a mouthy nerd in high school. And yeah, the jock doesn’t need to stuff the nerd in the locker. He just does it because he can. Zero fucks given.

Alcibiades
Guest
Alcibiades
Offline

Do you go around tossing water on every girl that shit tests you or every guy that gives you shit? No, of course you don’t, unless your on a stage show where comedy is being digested, or you’re literally mentally handicapped. I don’t agree that ZFG = alpha, and also this isn’t even real ZFG either. ZFG would be for Burt to have laughed his ass off or ignored the comment entirely and start talking to Leno. You fuckin guys, get with the program. No wonder men have become bitches, we got fake alpha propaganda runnin wild around here. When are all you fuckers gunna grow up. Next thing you’ll be telling me is that tattoos = alpha also, “OH cuse its zero fucks given!” My god, is this the best men have to offer? I don’t mind Roosh’s analysis of this but generally speaking looking towards celebrities isn’t always the best bet I don’t think for male traits to emulate.

It’s rare you’ll find a celebrity with somekind of real alpha traits, and if he is displaying them he’s probably faking them in a movie or something. Regardless I do think Burt played it off in a funny manner that would attract most girls and the audience, so if you think group think = alpha than there’s that to consider also. But in nature or tribal society this kinda behavior is mostly unnecessary. You could make the claim you have to shame your men to make them men, and maybe if you wanna run with that premise than this all makes sense and Burt = alpha. If this was a tribal society setup, Burt would be the ‘low-level-alpha’ whose training the beta, but Burt wouldn’t be the tribal leader. No tribal leader would fuck around wasting their time shaming the low level beta’s of the tribe, they pass right over them, or get the Burt wannabe fake alphas to put them in their place, but make no mistake, Burt isn’t like the king chief here by any means.

Alcibiades
Guest
Alcibiades
Offline

Honestly, after watching it again I think Burt only tosses water on him because of the crowds reaction to him being insulted. It’s basically just group think / conformist mentality from Burt. If your the tribal leader, the real alpha in the room, you would have so much real status and social capital accumulated that even idiot Marc wouldn’t say what he did; i.e. “I’m still married by the way.” Can you imagine Marc saying that same thing to a retired military General or the President? Forget Trump from the equation cuse he’s ruined the legitimacy of the office, but generally speaking anyone with super high social status that ‘EVERYONE’ knows isn’t going to get some jackass comment on a late night talk show. Maybe they would nowadays cuse society is such trash and no one gives a shit about the merit of an office or our elected officials (different discussion altogether).

Point being that Burt’s social capital isn’t really all that high if you’re having a Nickelodeon beta insulting you. This isn’t to say I think hyper well known people are more ‘alpha’ – not at all – not by any means, but in societies eyes and in most peoples eyes there are distinct differences people the image you represent and show to the public and who you actually are. The public only see’s your image. I don’t think Burt was badass enough to be taken completely seriously.

Replace Burt with Clint Eastwood for fucks sake. Is Marc faggot Summers gunna say the say thing to him, fuck no. And I actually think most of Eastwood’s persona is partly real alpha, but mostly just character traits he adopted over the decades of portraying alphas. Regardless throw in a more perceived badass actor or man and Marc wouldn’t say shit.

The threat threshold for obedience should be so fuckin normalized in the man that no one’s gunna make a dumbass jab at you. I like a natural good humored man like Burt who knows how to have a laugh and acts like ‘The Most Interesting Man In The World” kinda shit too, but if you have beta fucks trying to jab you, you might be missing something. It’s not to say be stone cold lifeless hard ass but I think for this beta dude to even attempt what he did shouldn’t have ever crossed his mind in the first place.

Think if it was a Pope or a Priest or Clint Eastwood. They have such clear defined social persona’s you know exactly what you see is what you get and you don’t consider outright mocking them even in a playful way the way he did. So, while Burt does have some solid form and built in response time traits I think he was missing something crucial to be bestowed with the true alpha title.

Alcibiades
Guest
Alcibiades
Offline

It should be noted my mention of the Pope and or a Priest. Typically not hard asses, not stone cold stoics like Eastwood, but its knowing exactly who you are which gives off the impression of self dignity. A priest isn’t some ZFG asshole whose gunna throw water on you, obviously, but there social capital surrounding him has such a clear distinction that you don’t cross THAT line. Super movie stars like Eastwood have this built in ‘dignity’ too, because I mean, lets be honest, how could you not be self assured when everyone loves you for no reason other than who they think you are (i.e. playing a role in a movie).

The point here is a big one and Roosh and other men who fin d this reading should take note if you actually wanna get somewhere in life.

Its this:

Women have social dignity – now before you freak out over that – consider that EVERY girl is going to anti-slut shame you. Every girl might literally be a slut, BUT 99% (maybe that high – TBD) will claim they have DIGNITY and SHOULD be respected, blah blah blah. And guess what? They get away with it. Because the social capital (the illusion) surrounding the female gender ‘MUST be respected at all costs.’ This sounds obvious right, a lot of men know this.

Men on the other hand have ZERO social capital unless they have a position of somekind which bestows this obvious status. The point here is men have lost all dignity and respect. Women have too in many ways. But men have entirely flushed that concept down the drain. So much so that a man is seen as a pussy if he claims to be ‘respected’. It sounds pussy even typing it, “ohhh respect me!” But that’s the ultimate distinction going on here ok. Men have no clear dignity and so EVERYONE railroads the fuck out of them, and men railroad each other also. Any guy who has even a shred of self respect and dignity (i.e. as seen by Burt) gets articles written about him online as if he’s a ‘real alpha’ when all he did was show real self respect, or tried to.

No girl wants to be labeled a slut and so the one thing they have going for them is they can cry double standards all day long even if they are a pornstar. But the simple truth here is men let everyone (other men included – other men especially) run the fuck over them – left, right, and center. It’s fuckin embarrassing.

Society currently no clear distinction for being a ‘man’ and what his social capital entails. This is for a lot of reasons but mostly because society has co-opted his identity and men have allowed it to happen.

You should know exactly who you are which gives off the impression of self dignity. OR society should see your role and it should be so fucking obvious to them what kind of man they’re dealing with. Like I said, a priest isn’t some ZFG asshole whose gunna throw water on you, obviously, but their social capital surrounding him has such a clear distinction that you don’t cross THAT line. Even in this demented ass society we live in, some titles and people have such clear roles and self-assuredness that even a Nickelodeon beta isn’t gunna try to take jabs at you. It’s not just about being self-assured, it should be the simple concept that we are men, for fucks sake, seriously, women and betas RAILROAD the fuck out of men because MEN LET THEM. This isn’t to say you go full physical ALL THE TIME, not at all, it means being self-assured, and it also means you give the impression that you are man and there are certain conditions and a certain way to talk to you which are appropriate. It sounds like a fuckin girls seminar, but its the fucking truth.

The short answer is the concept of insulting the man should be as sacred as the concept of insulting the girl or even a kid. You don’t just throw water on a bitch cuse she says some dumbass shit, you don’t just throw water on a kid cuse he says some dumbass shit, and the same with men. You don’t just throw water on a brother cuse he said some dumbass shit.

Women have “soooo much respect AND soooo much personal dignity” that their lies became ‘truth’ and perception became reality to the public. Do they really have self respect and personal dignity? I don’t know, that’s their own souls problem, but I know a lot, and I mean ALOT , don’t. I’m not encouraging men to go out their and lie about their personal dignity, but if anything men need to at very, AT VERY LEAST, fake it til you make it. The fuckin fake alphas at least give the impression that they ‘respect themselves’ even though any guy with half a brain knows he really doesn’t. The point is the concept of ‘the man’ needs to be completely and totally reclaimed to the fullest measure possible. If that doesn’t happen than there’s really no hope left for the West.

When shit hits the fan is actually when the best things can happen. Believe it or not, at least were in a time where a man can at least PRESENT and CARRY himself with a bit of dignity. He doesn’t need wealth to be dignified which gets mixed up sometimes. Like I said, the goal should be to have such a clear distinctive identity as a man that theres obvious boundaries others don’t cross. Women have their ‘clear boundaries’ and society believes them because they faked it til they mad eit. I get super sluts and pornstars telling me to treat them with respect. It’s the funniest thing ever. And the saddest part is a SHIT TON of men believe them. It’s not to say treat her like garbage, the point is her and EVERY other girl has said it so many fuckin times now that EVERYONE and their mother agrees so they think “Oh, it MUST be true, OF COURSE you treat her with respect!” – The two aren’t always mutually exclusive though, she is a human being after all, so she does deserve some respect – this is why the gray area kills men for some reason. They realize her inherent human dignity and her and EVERY other girl bitching to be respected and so they BUY it to be true for EVERY damn random hoe. Should men parrot back out to EVERYONE the same way for respect? I think YES, they absolutely should. The problem is to a lot of men it sounds ‘gay’ or something. But having self-respect is just as simple as acting how Burt did in the clip minus the initiating conflict part. Hopefully some dudes read this shit and get what I’m saying. It’s nothing new, but to literally demand some respect and establish the ABSOLUTE CLEAR FRAME THAT YOU ARE A MAN MUST be established or it’s game over for the West. “Oh, what does it mean to be a man? Blah blah blah All I would say is don’t over think that shit, but also emulating does help. The MAN needs to be as clear a distinction as a priest or a well known movie star, if he’s not than he loses and so do the rest of us. Why do you think women freak the fuck out if one girl goes against the girl group herd? It’s cuse they know one lone slut will spoil the bunch. Men use to have this kinda shit under control, not sure how it can be completely regained though. I give you permission to jack these ideas Roosh, not that you need it, but we all do.

Alcibiades
Guest
Alcibiades
Offline

Long story short about Burt – Marc thought he was his ‘equal’ or at very least thought he could get away with bein a dick. Replace Burt with a real alpha, the thought of insulting then would never cross his mind. This isn’t to say Burt is beta, just missing something major that would deter a beta from insulting him. Some might make the claim that, ‘He insulted him EXACTLY because Burt IS ALPHA, and was trying to test his dominance” or whatever – but that doesn’t hold to logically or rational scrutiny.

Anyone raised by an alpha dad (I know few of you guys out there sad to say these days) know that the thought of insulting your old man doesn’t even cross your mind cuse you know you’ll get your ass beat. Burt was a bit too playful, granted I give him props for putting the dude in his place, but ultimately it should never cross Marc or anyone else’s mind to think they can just insult you and get away with it.

Random hoe’s shit test like crazy nowadays cuse they know big daddy government will step in for them, but any guy who brushes that hit off gets +bonus points form the girls. The real problem though is these hoes should never even consider shit testing men in the first place, it should never even cross their minds. If you’re a dad you’ll know you’ve failed if you have to physically escalate to beating your kid (i.e. spanking or something) in order to control the kid. The verbal threats and intimidation should be enough to keep your kid in check. So, when you hear of dudes beating girls its cuse she probably deserved that shit but he failed at some point with her cuse everything he said she didn’t take serious. And that’s the real kicker here. If she can’t take you serious (not to mention if you don’t take yourself serious) than its a lose lose. Burts display is like a dad who is wrestling with his kid cuse his kid is a smartass. I never wrestled with my dad, my dad wasn’t a faggot like that, but if I was acting up he’d pull out the belt and fuck I stopped immediately acting out. All of that has been lost. No parent will tell you they want to spank or threaten their kid, but men seriously need to dial into their fuckin balls, for fucks sake.

Alcibiades
Guest
Alcibiades
Offline

If you get enough men out there brushing off shit tests, not reacting to girls bullshit, and genuinely dumping the trash girls throw at men instantly than maybe, JUST MAYBE, men have a chance. But solid game advice has been out there for about a decade and it seems to only be getting worse.

Honestly the one thing every man should do is simply INSTANTLY IGNORE EVERY GIRL the MOMENT she says some stupid shit about you or insults you in any way. But try telling the soy faggots and beta’s that, or the fuckboys goin in for the easy notch count. If men don’t work together it’s over.

There really isn’t any ‘game’ to play with girls. She doesn’t show you respect than shes gone, easy, boom. You could write that book in one page. And its just NORMAL human respect bullshit too. Where the FUCK HAS THAT SHIT GONE? Normal human self respect (for yourself as a man) where the fuck did that shit go? Would you continue begging a fuckin stranger for her number if she openingly rejects your ass over and over and over and over and over, like holy fucking shit man. Its fuckin embarrassing. Walk the fuck away, my god.Men work together or they lose, we’re are own worst enemies.

You basically need a combination of self-respect and dignity towards EVERYONE, not just women, but men, and children, everyone. That’s really the golden ticket there, but trying telling the average man that. Idunno man, I think if there’s one thing, ONE THING ONLY MEN NEED TO DO, its to have INSTANT and IMMEIDATE DIGNITY for self ALWAYS no matter where and no matter when and no matter what cost. That’s the ONE THING EVERYMAN should ALWAYS do on a constant basis. Respect yourself and you can respect others, but if she treats you like shit or someone else does they don’t deserve your attention or response or anything. Go home praying for them knowing they lost a good man and knowing youll do better and that any insults they threw at you were nothing important nor effect you but simply their inability to love others. Again, it all sorta sounds like a womens seminar, but seriously, I don’t see any men with self respect. Why? Because its fuckin hard. Everyone is against you, but when you do even slightly respect yourself on a game show Roosh will write an article about you. Cheers to that.

Alcibiades
Guest
Alcibiades
Offline

In conclusion it doesn’t mean getting buthurt over every little remark either, or just simply writing anyone and everyone off for the smallest little indiscretion, its actually the opposite of that. The point was men have no PERSONA or AURA (if you wanna call it that) to them nowadays. There is no singular definition for the DIGNITY of a man. Maybe instantly writing off girls or people who insult you isn’t the ‘best’ move, but it seems like a step in the right direction at least. I would just like to see men reclaim their dignity is all. For men to have their natural status acknowledged. But we’ve given away all out power. I don’t know what the answer is, I just know men don’t have the dignity (or perceived dignity) which EVERY woman is bestowed with AND men don’t act like they care so OF COURSE no one else is gunna give a fuck. That quickest path to reclaiming that seems to be to instantly write off people who insult you, but I’m sure there’s much better approaches, anyways that’s my two cents.

Alcibiades
Guest
Alcibiades
Offline

It should be noted some wannabe alphas take this too far and write off men (decent normal men) for the slightest infractions or whatever in an attempt to remain ‘alpha’. That’s not the way its suppose to work. Again, if you can’t take an insult or ‘constructive critcism’ you’re not alpha, you fall under the category of beta bitch and the man your writing off should actually be the one writing your ass off. The point here being that ‘writing people off’ is reserved for either extreme egregious situations (with people you know) or immediately with people you don’t know.

But you don’t do a tic for tact thing either, this isn’t chess or checkers bullshit, no alpha keeps track of a faggot score between people. The whole point is if someone in society who you don’t know gives you shit (especially a girl) than don’t placate to that bullshit. That’s where I’m comin form with all of this. And also ‘red pill’ men or guys who ‘get it’ need to be more open to correcting these betas and white knights rather than writing them off. It doesn’t mean you gotta be these homo’s freidns but you should be able to correct any wrongs.

I do give Burt that much in the clip, by the end of it he’s basically buddy buddy with the homo which is (imo deceptive) but at least its the impression of rights overcoming wrongs. I’m generalizing here but the mian point to be noted through this all is to not be a dick about everything but to not bend over for everything either. Again, nothing new that most men reading this don’t already, but the concept of identity and the clear distinction of what a man is and means need emphasized 100 fold and other men need to drag the beta’s up too, I hate to say it, cuse I don’t like dead weight that white knights but it has to be done unfortunately to some capacity .

Alcibiades
Guest
Alcibiades
Offline

I’m gunna rephrase my comment above – EVERYMAN SHOULD INSTANTLY CONDEMN EVERY GIRL IF SHE IS ACTUALLY SHITTING ON YOU (NOT necessarily every man, that’s on a case by case basis). Above I said everyman should IGNORE every girl for shit testing, but what really needs done is to condemn every girl. And by ‘CONDEMN’ I mean socially shame AND then IGNORE (i.e. walk away).

Basically you do what EVERY girl has done to every guy. She socially condemns the man for his comment (‘That’s mean, that’s, rape, that’s messed up, that’s sexist, that’s bullshit, etc. INSERT stereotype) and then she walks away or ignores you. So men need to simply employ the EXACT same thing. CONDEMN HER BEHAVIOR AND THEN IGNORE. Boom, done. Nothin else is needed, if she comes back and apologizes then you give her a hug and treat her right, if she doesn’t come back with her tail between her legs shes gone, that simple.

But its not just with girls. This shit needs to be literally every interaction in society. Just look at how insanely far women have taken this shit. The first thing that comes to mind are female news casters…an alpha or semi-alpha guy will say some alpha shit and some feminist will CONDEMN, then precede to banish and or ignore him. ITS ALWAYS the SAME. Its as if men subdued women this way for so many thousands of years that theyre programmed to act it out.

The REAL way the male/female interaction is suppose to go down is the exact opposite: The girl says some dumb shit, the man corrects her and condemns the idea, if she continues on like she does he ignores her and banishes her and or gets someone with authority to get rid of her. THATS how the men controlled women in the past. She was allowed to speak AND THEN she had ONE of TWO options – she could say some smart shit and get approved and ‘look special’ or she would get called out and condemned and banished. This why women never speak up, the threat of banishment was always hanging over their heads if they said some stupid shit which they probably were going to do.

Moral of the story: women have been subdued for fuckin ever and now they are roleplaying their self projection out onto men. We’ve programmed them so fucking well via submission that their only [output] function is really just to do the same few simple [input] / [output] replies and rebuttal:

– Man talks
– Girl is either attracted or not; i.e. condemns or accepts
– Girl either ignores or calls for reinforcements to get rid of and banish the male

The girl is in reality just self-projecting out onto men her own submission from thousands of years. Men have subdued them so well she has no other output function. When men reverse it back to the original role her mind can’t really comprehend both at the same time and so you’ll see girls who are super insanely slutty waiting to get f’ed in that very moment all while at the exact same time ready to banish you. Its really just their simple input output has been massively reversed as have mens. Men thankfully I think can reverse it back for a longer period of time. Women on the other hand are now conditioned to switch back and forth at will. Anyways that’s some wack speculation but I think a lot of it holds up to scrutiny. Enjoy.

Alcibiades
Guest
Alcibiades
Offline

The caveat to all of this is she’s still a person worthy of respect – but when society has gone so incredibly overboard with giving girls respect than its difficult to justify giving her any in the first place. Best course of action is to treat all people the same with dignity and respect – seriously – and then from there you can take it on a case by case basis. CONDEMN or ACCEPT -> BANISH or TRAIN – those are your choices. Make um count.

Anti-Gnostic
Guest
Anti-Gnostic
Offline

“The REAL way the male/female interaction is suppose to go down is the exact opposite: The girl says some dumb shit, the man corrects her and condemns the idea, if she continues on like she does he ignores her and banishes her and or gets someone with authority to get rid of her. THATS how the men controlled women in the past.”

Please offer several historical examples demonstrating exactly this male/female interaction you describe.

Anti-Gnostic
Guest
Anti-Gnostic
Offline

“Every girl might literally be a slut…”

LOL. Some assuredly, but not as many as you believe.

“Because the social capital (the illusion) surrounding the female gender ‘MUST be respected at all costs.’ This sounds obvious right, a lot of men know this.”

Actually what men know is that they will afford respect when due. When it comes to the female persuasion, men generally understand when to put them in their proper place. No need to be walking on eggshells.

“Men on the other hand have ZERO social capital unless they have a position of somekind which bestows this obvious status.”

Their status comes from how they treat themselves and others, not by manospherist claptrap.

“The point here is men have lost all dignity and respect.”

Men themselves can individually make that call regarding their “social capital” in relation to dignity and respect. You are making a sweeping generalization based on subjectivity.

“But the simple truth here is men let everyone (other men included – other men especially) run the fuck over them – left, right, and center. It’s fuckin embarrassing.”

It sounds like you are projecting here. It is other than alpha.

“that even a Nickelodeon beta isn’t gunna try to take jabs at you.”

It’s called a neg.

“The point is the concept of ‘the man’ needs to be completely and totally reclaimed to the fullest measure possible. If that doesn’t happen than there’s really no hope left for the West.”

So who is to say that your definition of “man” or your concept of “the man” is THE standard for men to follow. The bottom line is that men themselves can make that call. They need not your virtue signaling.

“I get super sluts and pornstars telling me to treat them with respect.”

Names?

“Long story short about Burt – Marc thought he was his ‘equal’ or at very least thought he could get away with bein a dick. Replace Burt with a real alpha, the thought of insulting then would never cross his mind.”

The reality is that Marc touched a nerve and Burt acted like a spoiled brat.

Winters
Guest
Winters
Offline

If a girl ginsults you in front of everyone or she gives you a shit test do you toss water on her? To think this is real alpha behavior is pretty naïve honestly. Like yeah we get it ok, he’s protecting his reputation and putting this bitch in his place, but what if a CHILD a real ten year old kid said this, or a girl, how do you respond then? It actually makes Burt look like he gets butthurt over any little thing someone says.

While I generally agree if its another real ‘alpha’ guy he’s talking to and he did this than it would be real alpha behavior, but he does it to this guy cuse he’s a bitch, I wanna see Burt do this to a girl or little kid who says the same thing. Imagine how much of a butthurt little bitch Burt would look like if he tossed water on a girl or little kid. Burt’s acting like a butthurt bitch ‘alpha’, not real alpha at all. Marc is obviously beta boy so Burt knows he can get away with it, but its so much easier just to shame this homo than to get all butthurt about it. Moral of the story – only engage real alpha’s if youre an alpha, otherwise brush it off or shame him. The opportunity to shame this beta boy was so incredibly high but Burt decided to play around with him, it really undermines any real alpha Burt’s trying to act like having.

Winters
Guest
Winters
Offline

Here’s another example to try on for size. Replace Marc with not a girl or little kid, but replace him with an ‘alpha’ which society has deemed to be ‘the most alpha’. In other words instead of Marc replace him with Brad Pitt or something and imagine Pitt saying the same thing to Burt then. If Brad Pitt said, “I’m still married as a matter of fact.” to Burt THEN imagine Burt tossing water on Pitt. Think about that for a moment. He would look beta as all hell. But the same truth as already mentioned holds true. If Burt told Pitt, “Do you talk like that to everyone?” Suddenly Pitt looks socially inept and has to play defense. But imagine if Burt dumped water on Pitt after that comment, he would look so insanely beta. And to me that’s what he looks like here. He doesn’t look alpha at all, because its not real alpha behavior. The only thing remotely ‘alpha’ is that Burt knows that he can get away with being the school yard bully to this homo guy Marc. But is the schoolyard bully the ‘most alpha’? Maybe, but most of the time he’s not.

Winters
Guest
Winters
Offline

What does kind of make the situation interesting I guess is that the ‘fun humor’ / ‘jesting’ has already been established into the social situation and so Burt is playing off of that. If he all of a sudden said something ‘serious’ [such as “Do you talk like that to everyone?”] in response to Marc’s initial comment of “I’m still married” it would basically take him out of the social humor of the situation that was already established, but even then I hold to the point that it would make more sense to verbally social shame him [“Do you talk like that to everyone?”] than to take the humor road the way he did. Not to mention but Burt wasn’t bein funny at all from the get go. He didn’t need to play into the humor frame or the rebuttal frame. Women typically have this kind of response on lock down because theyre conditioned to not ever attempt physical confrontation.

Replace Burt with a girl actress who was divorced and imagine Marc saying the exact same thing to her, “I’m still married by the way.” Not only would the audience probably gasp, but lets say they did laugh about it in the same way. She would reply to him, “Do you talk like that to everyone?” All of sudden he would look like a social idiot and buffoon. This isn’t to say tailor your responses like a girl, but it is to say that when it comes to social calibration and shaming people girls normally have an instinctive way of shaming men in front of others while socially covering up their own flaws. And actually media is tailored for them to do this as much as humanly possible.

Burt’s divorce apparently is the catalyst for this statement from Marc, but would a girl allow the divorce to be the driving force of humor – would she allow herself to be mocked? No, cuse girls cover up all their slutty ways, or they try to at least. Point is simply that this whole stage show act is constructed for the benefit of girls. Again its not to say act feminine, not at all, but whats being presented is tailored for a girls approach in society.

If this was 2,000 years ago the approach society takes was tailored for men. If a man insulted you, you could literally engage in hand to hand combat, you were literally allowed to kill this other man; i.e. think of pistol duels. If a man insulted you it was for the opportunity for him to call you out and literally kill you, or make an example of him. But the stage show of society is geared towards the reaction women present. Men actually have the luxury of being rather dignified nowadays MORE SO THAN ever because the reactionless man in todays society is seen as superior. Especially when society is geared towards a reaction for everything.

To react to such nonsense is beta, its not alpha. Women typically are allowed to be reactionless, they don’t have to reply, to ANYTHING, generally speaking. If a man takes the same approach in todays society he’s immortalized, but few men know how to do such a thing, and those who are in the society spotlight are the farthest from knowing how or emulating such behavior. Your never going to find real alpha traits being presented in society. Not even dudes who go into the woods to live are real alpha either bytheway so don’t fool yourself.

Winters
Guest
Winters
Offline

Ya know its interesting cuse there is a time and a place for the physical escalation of this stuff. I was just on your Twitter and you had some link about Joe Biden and showing how he gropes tons of little girls. If I’m the parent and I see that shit going on Joe is a dead man, plain and simple. Or you tell him as he’s doing it, “What the fuck are you doing?” and push his face away and or just beat his dumb ass, the fact he gets away with that shit is fuckin mind blowing to me. But yeah situations like that call for basically immediate physical escalation. But with Marc and this whole thing, I dunno, probably not, good comedic timing on Burt’s part but still doesn’t seem like real alpha to me. Anyways glad to see someone still willing to analyze ‘alpha’ behavior these dark days.

Bluedragon
Guest
Bluedragon
Offline

Spot on Winters!

cs_rlewis
Member
New Member
cs_rlewis
Offline

Lol @ Aziz ansari. I cant believe that guys sitcom earned him an award.

Lysander
Guest
Lysander
Offline

I tried to find some more interviews like this one where the first guest remains while the host interviews the second guest. I’m sure there are many, but I was only able to find a couple. And the ones I did find, the second guest was mainly making eye contact with the host but they didn’t have their back completely turned to the first guest. So I can understand why Burt was triggered and decided to give Marc a lesson in manners.

What isn’t mentioned in this article is that Marc makes the first snide remark by condescendingly saying “No, I can talk to you, too, Burt.” So at this point they were even or you can even say that Marc had the upper hand because he first disrespected Burt by turning his back completely to him, Burt reprimanded him, and then he made the condescending remark. And it looks like it could have ended there.

But then Marc “Summers” Berkowitz, quite sure of his Hollywitz safe space and thinking that he has asserted frame, continues the belittling by putting his goddamn hand on the goy Burt and making that brazen remark about his divorce. His false sense of (((security))) made him cross the line. And he paid for it by being emasculated on national TV. To the point where he’s talking about it to this day and leaving out some of the more humiliating nuisances which have been brought up in this article.

It’s also amusing how he sits like Burt these days during interviews: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WenC6gGZJJM

William Rubin
Member
Member
William Rubin
Offline

I really enjoyed that clip, cause it was fuckin funny. Thank you Roosh.

The problem with being an alpha is you have to be on guard all the time, and your time at the top doesn’t last very long.

Rooshes
Guest
Rooshes
Offline

I only see two losers.

You want to see how alpha behave check 60 days in reality show. Or work in a construction site.

Where can I find the list of the books SPLC banned?

david
Guest
david
Offline

i saw something like this happen with brendan frasier mocking the rock dwayne johnson at some awards thing. It was brushed off as planned, but i dont think it was

Anton
Guest
Anton
Offline

The Brains Behind AOC Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1h5iv6sECGU&feature=youtu.be

This is called organization, something totally missing on the normal to right political front.

Alcibiades
Guest
Alcibiades
Offline

Right Wingers either don’t mind just trusting in ‘the system’ or they think they can ‘do it all themselves’ – literally. Minorities are always the underdogs, but definition that’s what makes them a minority. So they have to come up with ‘clever’ (i.e. cheat the system) ways to win. A Right Wing neocon would rather invest their money in a candidate and sit back, few (with money to run) care about starting some grass roots shit or gaming the system. Alt-right is dead, but if up and coming conservatives wanna try the same thing than I think more power to them. I wouldn’t mind helping some group willing to bend the rules also. But at the end of the day most conservatives and Right wingers don’t really care about getting their hands dirty. Give it like another 10-20 years when shit rally hits the fans AND THEN the Right will be clamoring hard – why? – because they’ll be the minority and they’ll have to. Trying to get some Right wing political uys on board to do some shit like this would probably take a long ass time honestly. Right wing men are more hardcore and more dominant (normally – at least more so than the Left) and so trying to get a bunch of Right dudes seeing eye to eye is difficult. The ‘agenda’ would have to be pretty clear cut and straight forward otherwise you risk having to many Chiefs and not enough Indians. Libs are the most conformist people around. Don’t be fooled by all their perceived ‘non-conformity’, they’re just trying to be special snowflakes, but they are by and large pigs to the slaughter -why? – cuse they’re all beta and easily malleable. Its a lot more difficult to get the political Right to ralley cuse they are more stubborn and normally go their own ways. Not unless the shit hits the fan do Right wingers ever feel compelled to start grass roots – like I said, were not even close to being there yet. I mean, don’t get me wrong, its obviously at STAGE CRITICAL right now, like the Right ABSOLUTLY needs to DO SOME SHIT rather than relying on monopoly establishment neocon’s, but all I’m sayin is the average Right wing guy could care less, it’s not at critical mass for him yet, cuse he’s built to take major hits and to endure. The Right wing traditional male dud eis built to endure all of the bullshit AND MORE that you throw at him (at the leats the real ones that I know of) and so they almost look like doormats you can walk all over (and a lot are) but all I’m sayin is its not in their nature to do something so manipulative and underhanded. They normally try to play by the rules. Regardless, the Right should take note and probably be doing the same thing, at very least as a counter measure.

Reader
Guest
Reader
Offline

Marc has poor manners and is rude. I don’t understand why Burt let himself be provoked, but perhaps Burt due to his divorce just lost control.
Burt should have ignored Marc’s crudeness. So one sees how both Burt and Marc really don’t treat the audience with respect. Degeneration with help of the morons who presented both juveniles a second creampie. Too bad for USA.

splooge
Guest
splooge
Offline

perhaps or beta dont know what he can get away in that situation.
Like can you imagine if Burt did that on Memri tv its gonna be a fight.
dont think you can just do that on national tv or at a club.

like wouldnt you lose frame as well if you got up and punched oz in the face and started shit talking all those fat chicks

Ronnie Evil
Member
Ronnie Evil
Offline

Burt unloads on that guy. That totally rocked the little Mark.

CityMonger
Guest
CityMonger
Offline

Wow, I haven’t been on ths site in a year or so. And boy has the quality of comments gone down the drain.

Frankly from what I see in the comments section, your average reader is pretty bitch made these days.

Keep up the good work Roosh. I still listen to your live streams and vlogs. I guess the real online discussion under the Roosh banner is only on the forum now. Too bad. Between this site and RoK, we had a really good run.

AutomaticSlim
Guest
AutomaticSlim
Offline

Monger???
Do you mean what I think that means?

AutomaticSlim
Guest
AutomaticSlim
Offline

Famous beta males like Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk, Anthony Bourdain, and Aziz Ansari

Bezos: bangs old bags. He’s clueless

Musk: At least he bangs hot younger women like Amber Heard.

Bourdain: Seemed like a decent guy in some ways. Disagreed 100% with his politics, but like his show and he seemed like a cool guy to hang out and drink with. But his taste in women was AWFUL! As bad or even worse than Bezos.

Ansari: Who?

Mr Lemon
Guest
Mr Lemon
Offline

This is timeless. Every single interaction in your life as a man will involve these sorts of pecking-order interactions. Any career, any workplace, any relationship, any office, all of your life. If you’re not that alpha, it’s not worth it to pretend. Burt and Marc could have had a much more fun time if Marc had just let Burt be Burt and not tried to challenge him.

Men work best together and most happily when the betas accept the alpha’s dominance and work together as a team. That’s the basis of all great achievements. Steve Jobs’ workers loved having him as the boss, because he was that good and completely clear what the target was. They could do their jobs without worry. In the same way, submissive wives crave a strong husband who sets very clear pathways for the family, or conversely, a beta man wants a woman who can give him guidance without humliating him in public.

Anti-Gnostic
Guest
Anti-Gnostic
Offline

“Every single interaction in your life as a man will involve these sorts of pecking-order interactions.”

Which are subjective in nature. One man’s interpretation of alpha is another man’s interpretation of beta.

“Burt and Marc could have had a much more fun time if Marc had just let Burt be Burt and not tried to challenge him.”

LOL, it’s called a neg. Burt got all bent out of shape over a neg. Total gamma play on Burt’s part.

“Men work best together and most happily when the betas accept the alpha’s dominance and work together as a team.”

Assuming that the alpha is an alpha and the beta is a beta. Pray tell, are you a secret king?

“In the same way, submissive wives crave a strong husband who sets very clear pathways for the family…”

Actually, wives crave a husband, and husbands crave a wife, who together set a clear pathway for the family.

“or conversely, a beta man wants a woman who can give him guidance without humliating him in public.”

The reality is that men and women in their relationship seek guidance from one another.

Again, are you a secret king?

Mr Lemon
Guest
Mr Lemon
Offline

Which are subjective in nature. One man’s interpretation of alpha is another man’s interpretation of beta.

Congratulations on writing the most meaningless sentence of the week.

Anti-Gnostic
Guest
Anti-Gnostic
Offline

“Congratulations on writing the most meaningless sentence of the week.”

How gamma of you to say.

Alcibiades
Guest
Alcibiades
Offline

I really DGAF about the skin tone / ethnicity of the dude as long as he’s constitutionalist tradcon of some kind. And even being a constitutionalist doesn’t mean a whole hell of a lot. Ideally the political Right just needs dudes who are hardcore trad, that’s really the main thing they need, if they have that as their backbone pretty much everything else falls into place fine. Unfortunately Dems have been playing the race card for so many decades now that they have virtually all minority voters.

So, realistically if the political right actually wants to follow suit and try the same shit that the ‘Justice’ Dems are doing they would simply caucus the shit out of minority areas with tall goodlooking men who match the demographics of the area. I don’t have anything against omen ok, but they really should stay the fuck out of politics, so this whole idea of trying to do EXACTLY the same thing as the Dems by running black female republicans is flawed. If you wanna run miniorty dudes go right ahead, but they just gotta be hardcore Trad, that’s really the main thing that needs done.

Women and young voters are so incredibly superficial that if the Right actually wants to try something like this they need young, jacked, goodlooking dudes who basically look like movie stars – seriously – they need to be the best looking dudes you can find – and you gunna need LOTS of them. There’s realistically not many ways to directly counter wht the ‘Justice’ Dems are doing here cuse what they’re doing plays into their hands cuse of the minority votes and everything. But, if you caucus a shit ton of tall, jacked, goodlooking, dudes with beards trust me when I say the female voter will think twice. “Ohhhh, do I wanna vote for the black woman cuse I’m a black woman??? Or the tall, jacked, bearded, black guy?” – Its a no brainer almost.

Women are insanely superficial. Get a shit ton of tall, jacked, bearded bro’s in well tailored suits strutting around form caucus to causus and female voters will think twice. But other than that I don’t really see how the Right could play the exact same game.

Anders
Guest
Anders
Offline

Hey Roosh. Good job spreading that philosophy of the New Zealand shooter through your forum.

That’s what you did. You made the world worse.

I hope you get banned from the United States and end up homeless in a cardboard box. Faggot.

Old Man Wise
Guest
Old Man Wise
Offline

Hmmm…..wonder what kinda troll lurked into your account Roosh? For real here, this dude Anders above doesn’t sound sincere, maybe he is, but gotta love how he added that last sentence in there. “I hope you get banned form the United States.” How and why does some rando find your site and decide this is what they’re going to post? Hmmm….people only read media which THEY find interesting; i.e. we create our own echo chambers. Essentially people seek out reaffirming narratives and biases. In other words Anders most likely a troll or someone trying to push the overall narrative here.

Honestly I don’t really believe in false flag nonsense or I don’t wanna believe it. But it does seem weird or strange how EVERYONE and their mother LATCHES onto a SINGLE narrative when EVERYTHING I’ve read about this guy is confusing as all fuck. Like, seriously. I HAVE NO CLUE what this lunatic believes or doesn’t. Everything he said (from the little I’ve read) is like troll speak + weird rando talk + rando religious stuff + rando blah blah blah. I consider myself pretty well versed in the ‘man-o-shpere’ – I read ROK for years and I sorta think I ‘get or understand’ the ‘alt-right’ even thouh I don’t associate with them at all. Most men (like 99%) are just tradcon guys who like traditionalism generally speaking…+ now you have like a bunch of younger gamer incel dudes who wanna be ‘manly’ also – so I dunno, there’s a lot of weird hybrid ideas out there.

Generally speaking the ‘alt-right’ got the bad rap of being ‘racists’ or whatever, sometimes I think I understand these random conversative off-shoots ‘alt-light’ etc. But then I read about the and realize I don’t understand them at all. And this is coming form a guys whose been reading ‘man-o-shpere’ blogs for a long time. I mean, I just like trad values, really that’s it, all the political stuff – while interesting and sometimes entertaining – isn’t my cup of tea. And so I think it’s really REALLY REALLY bizarre that ANYONE could say they know exactly what the hell this rando psycho’s plan was. I didn’t read the ‘manifesto’ nor do I care. But the point is even the people who said they read it and the News reports and stuff all are totally different wave lengths. Obviously its horrific, but what is weird to me is how anyone could say they even know or could point to this dude’s intentions when everything I’ve read is ALL OVER THE PLACE. Like this guy was rando killer, he might’ve thought he had ‘plan’ but if anyone bestows a ‘plan’ onto this guy than imo they dunno wtf theyre talking about.

To say it’s a lunatic from the white supremacist part of the web ‘might’ be ‘correct’, and honestly some of those white supremiscist guys are definitely ‘out there’, but at the same time EVERYTHING else this freak said was so incredibly not normal and off that to try to ascribe his ideology to the ‘redpill /man-o-sphere’ is a stretch. It’s not a huge stretch or comparison to make, but rationally speaking its a massive stretch. Ya know what this guy is, he’s basically a cartoon character – he’s like the caricature of the FAR FAR Left’s imagination of what a FAR FAR Right wing neo Nazi would look like. It’s like someone in an office room fuckin ‘assembled’ (or was looking for) this guy, “Oh, well He’s GOT TO play videogames” – everyone in the board room nods there heads, “Yeah, yeah, definitely plays videogames” – “He’s GOT TO be far right” – everyone nods again, “Yeah, yeah, definitely FAR right” – “He’s GOT TO have ‘white nationalist’ leanings and likes Thor and Vahalla and ya know, plain old white nationalist shit” – “Yeah, yeah, definitely likes ‘white pride'” – “He’s ALSO GOT TO have traveled out of the country” – And honestly THATS the real kicker here – it’s not like he was some kid in his parents basement, this dude was obviously brainwashed at some point overseas. Like I said, I odn’t rally buy into false flag nonsense, but I think it’s possible someone most likely brainwashed this guy. It could very well just be some rando nutjob. But see, to me the whole ‘narrative’ is wack as fuck cuse it’s like there’s no fucking way to understand this guys real motives, he was an obvious fuckin nutjob. To say his rando political ideas fueled the shooting (while maybe true) should be applied to EVERYONE else online is the real purpose here. Do I like the idea of the government using random psychos to propel rando shooting to force feed a narrative, no of course not, no one wants to believe that shit, is it possible, maybe, I dunno. I hink this guy was too fuckin nutty to be controlled in some ways. I think he had his head fuled with a MASSIVE amount of weird random ideas from people who want to use him. Is this a ‘false flag’ though? Meh, I think it’s more of a case of some Islamic state brainwashing westerners to subvert and undermine the West.

The narrative is definitely going to be anti-white male / ‘far-right’ though, that much is pretty certain. How much the media will actually run with this is worth noting also.

I don’t like reposting some super faggot nutjobs words quite honestly but this link has a paragraph of some of the stuff he said I guess. Talking about ‘degeneracy’ and ‘valhalla’ – what real caught my attention was the word ‘degeneracy’ -its not a word that’s really ever used in normal conversation, if ever. In fact, the first time I heard the word was from a friend who reads stuff in the man-o-sphere. The point here is actually a big one. People don’t talk like that, even in the dying days of the quote unquote “man-o-sphere”, maybe like 5 or 6 years ago they talked about the ‘degeneracy’ and the ‘degenerate behavior’ of all the girls with purple hair and shit, but that kinda talk died out like 2 or 3 years ago if not longer.

Dudes simply don’t talk like that. Now, with that being said I don’t know about any 4chan shit or maybe some dudes do still talk like that, but I haven’t heard anyone (woth listening to at least) who has used that word in fuckin years. The point is this dude is like living out some demented fantasy form several years ago, or his ‘script’ was written for him several years ago. I don’t like speculating on this kinda shit cuse there’s a lotta nutjob dudes who take the ‘false flag’ idea WAY too far. Not trying to point fingers Roosh, but honestly some of the dudes that follow you are out of their minds, their speculation is as unsubstantial as this person above me who wants to blame Roosh for hate speech or whatever.

Point is on both ends of spectrum the speculation can get out of hand really fast. Anyways, I just wanted to give my two cents to Roosh and the loose loose remaining ‘man-o-sphere community’ that has been readin g Roosh for years that the nutjob shooters rantings seem incoherent and don’t seem to fall in line with Roosh or ROK or as far as I can tell any other man-o-sphere bloggers, then again I don’t read much fringe weird stuff, Roosh is about as ‘fringe’ as I get, but he’s only ‘fringe’ cuse he’s actually normal compared to all the other trash out there, all the other DEGENERATES. Again, that kinda language was used YEARS ago, Seriously, like I don’t necessarily buy into the idea this dude was ‘programmed’ and ‘released’ but I think he was mental and probably brainwashed when he was overseas at some point.

Anyways I don’t know what else to say about this, the Culuteral Marxists weren’t even the ‘targets’ of this psycho right? Like, this dude’s who narrative sounds like it was written about culuteral Marxists (DEGENERTAES) – because that word was MEANT AND USED EXPLICITLY FOR THEM – and was NEVER meant for Muslims. His narrative doesn’t line up. I don’t believe this was a ‘false flag’ – I believe it was some weird brainwashing conditioning of a dude who was against cultural Marxism but was told to take out Muslims? It makes no sense whatsoever, I can’t even wrap my head around the conflicting narrative points of view. LOST IN TRANSLATION – which o me means he was brainwashed overseas by an anti-west group trying to undermine the political right or something. Not to mention but the whole Pewdewpie thing is like a whole nuther weird ‘twist’ that doesn’t even fall into the narrative either, and him video taping it like a first person shooter videogame etc…Like how does the videgame aspect even fall into play? Again, the whole narrative of this guy is a random ass jugsaw puzzle, to try ot blai it on a group for ‘hatespeech’ or even Roosh is to remove yourself entirely from reality, like how this nutcase did. Anywasy I’ve spent enough time wasting my braincells on this psycho. The devil’s goal is to separate people, he’s the ‘king of confusion’ for a reason, anytime something doesn’t add up ro make sense and is unnecessarily confusing you can be sure satan is involved.

Oh, what I wanted to say before ranting was how they came up with a NARRATIVE SO FAST – HOW THE HELL DO YOU COME UP WITH A NARRATIVE SO QUICK ???? Like I already said, I don’t believe in ‘false flag’ mumbo jumbo but I wanna know who the hell wrote up this narrative for this chick to say. After 50 people are slaughtered SHOULDNT the human thing to do is pay your respects and say you’re looking into this guys motives, but that he just killed 50 people, so say “I doubt there’s any credibility to anything he says, or if it even matters” – AND MOVE ON, ok, its ‘terrorism’ point taken, but is there like some underground group of videogame psychopath terrorists or something we should know about…wtf??? but NO, theyre REALLY going to make a NARRATIVE around this, these people man, I’de be pissed if I lost someone I knew from a rando psycho and the police wanted to immediately create some crazy ass narrative.

Someone kills 50 people – whatever they say suddenly has merit???? If it was like some legitimate terrorist shit than sure, by all means, you have my attention for 2 seconds, but this guys ‘story’ from the little I’ve read of it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. Unless this dude has like top secret plans on the message boards he trolls at or the group who brainwashed him I don’t wanna hear shit from this looneys mouth. How can you take anything this nut says seriously? Doesn’t the government already have like oh, Idunno, a terrorist watch list, ffs. The ‘narrative’ is like they have no way of explaining it so they’re going to claim it’s triggered fringe right videogame players? Or that the alt-alt–alt-alt-alt-right/videogamers/who the f knows is promoting such radical hate speech that we should be on terror watch lists? Like what the hell are they even saying?

This dude is a loon who was overseas, obviously got brainwashed by some anti-west rhetoric and drank the Kool-Aid, prolly was ‘triggered’ by the group, and the rest is we have to sit hear and take his looney ideas as legitimate? Gimme a break media. He’s espousing years old ‘man-o-sphere’ rhetoric about cultural Marxism cuse he’s been a time capsule from 2013 or whatever. “Subscribe to Pewdepie” the dude is just a constructed robot from some terror group. The idea of ‘false flag’ undermines the west.

The FBI and CIA (as far as I can tell) is hell bent on doing anything and everything to make sure western ideas don’t become corrupted commie soviet union, my understanding of it is limited, but as far as I can tell they don’t mind ‘taking down’ (in this case arresting, not murder) people who will undermine that main cause, but the idea of ‘false flag’ like the CIA or FBI or one of the ‘good guys’ doing this is pure evil that the Government wouldn’t allow even in terms of ‘deep-state’ operations.

We’ll assassinate guys I’m sure, but we’re not going to brainwash guys and ‘trigger’ them. Who brainwashed this guy? An anti-west terror organization (most likely) alright. How do I know we don’t create INSANE ‘false flags’ like people try to run away with, because anyone whose worked a gov. job knows you can’t keep under wraps BIG SECRETS. It just doesn’t happen. Too many people talk, too much paperwork, and the age old saying is mostly in regards to aliens. Like, seriously, people in the gov. joke about securing aliens and the U.S. having alien technology etc.

The joke is that we have it, because we don’t. Because anyone whose worked a gov. job with even a normal security clearance is well aware that hundreds of different people are seeing every shred of paperwork, and the main point (about aliens) is that if they did exist we couldn’t keep something like that a secret. And, I firmly believe the same holds true with ‘false flag’ ideas like this. There’s an unfortunate need for people it seems to want to believe that ‘someone else’ is ‘pulling the strings’. But the truth is far less glamorous.

This is isn’t to say there might be some people who want to ‘pull the strings’ or ‘control this’ or ‘control that’ but normally its like I said, its not glamourous and would require lots of work and lots of people and the ‘big secret’ is that there really isn’t a ‘big secret’. Terrorists get off on making people work harder and deceive themselves. It’s easy to be self-deceived with stuff like this, we want to make it more complicated than it really is. If this guy has associates, than yeah, they definitely need found, but my whole point is simply that it’s normally more obvious than you think it is. In this case the narrative (while confusing and makes no sense) is still just an act of terror meant to create chaos. Who trains terrorists, etc. You can narrow down the list from there. Anyways I wanna know why in this clip they feel so compelled to run with the narrative that they do? We know of HUGE terror organizations, doesn’t it make more logical sense to say he was brainwashed from them? Why suddenly say some fringe rando’s online are also terrorists or feeding terror dogmas unless you wanna in the same breath say they also are terrorists? The logic of these people is mind numbing.

https://www.newsweek.com/8chan-christchurch-shooting-new-zealand-brenton-tarrant-what-8chan-4chan-1364129

the narrative that’s going to get thrown out there

https://www.newsweek.com/8chan-christchurch-shooting-new-zealand-brenton-tarrant-what-8chan-4chan-1364129

Islamic Terror
Guest
Islamic Terror
Offline

After thinking about it my first reaction is that this is actually Muslim on Muslim terrorism. In other words this guy went overseas and was mostly likely recruited by an Islamic terror group and was groomed to do something like this. Point being that I wouldn’t be surprised if Muslim extremists (i.e. terrorists) ‘trigger’ other Muslim terrorists by using a white man with a ‘pro white nationalist agenda’ as their cover story. I personally think everything this guy wrote online or maybe he really said it all (not sure) was simply written for him. A lot of what he said seems like a made ups story and or not consistent with any ‘agenda’ that I’m aware of.

In other words the terror group fabricated a story about this guy (a ‘pro white nationalist agenda’) so that after he kills ‘diverse muslims’ the other terror group muslims would be triggered. I dunno if any of that makes any sense, but basically the white man in this situation appears to just be a fall guy for another Islamic terror group. Obviously the Gov. wants to wipe this guys record from the internet cuse they don’t want other terror groups using it as fuel for other terror attacks. It has less to do with not showing the public how psycho this guy is and has more to do with giving the Islamic terror networks a reason (more excuses) for other jihads.

Some things which struck me which are worth mentioning that makes me think this is Islamic terror and not ‘white pride nationalism’. First off, the video game references, this is in line with more ‘death to the west’ ideological thought more than it is anything else. The point is to glamorize the violence – again – Islamic extremism (aka Islamic terror groups). I can’t think of really any white nationalist terror groups who (in the last 50 or so years) glamorized the violence in this way. This would be a ‘first’ in regards to some modern ‘white nationalist terror’ and how it was staged and made to extract and showcase as much violence as possible. This all speculation on my part (obviously) – like everyone else is currently doing, which is unfortunate, but is what it is.

My point though is that glamorizing the violence and recording it is something Islamic terror groups do. Not to mention but something else really subtle which caught my attention was the ‘first person shooter’ glamour killing. If you relate that style of glamourized violence to Islamic terror (i.e. Muslim religion) than it gives you a pretty big insight. Namely that Islam is self-focused, and reality revolves around the individual, everything is very subjective to the individual’s personal point of view, it’s really an exaggeration of a disassociated reality. Like I said, this is very subtle, but if you understand anything about modern Islam and their notions of how they view reality its very geared towards ‘self’ and it’s easy to see why the terror group behind this choose to make it seem ‘videogam-ish’. It really is two birds with one stone to the terror group; i.e. it glamourizes western violence, and it’s also an appealing psychological disposition for Islamic violence. The idea being if you think of western extremism or western terror it’s really from a completely different psychological disposition entirely. If a nutjob kid shoots up a school or movie theater it’s less contrived in this way, and when referring to actual white terror groups in the past like the K.K.K. the killings were less about the individual killing the person, and more about humiliating the person being killed. They’re two totally different psychological states of being. A white nationalist terror slaying would probably attempt to dominate and humiliate the group involved, or just look at anything the nazi’s did in world war 2, it’s a slow burn, a slow death, its torturous and they bleed you dry and try to humiliate you every chance they get. Whereas modern terror from the Middle East is far less about humiliation and more about submission – because of their self-projection and ‘submission’ to Allah, etc. It revolves more around the killer than the person being killed. Anyways, the whole point there is that filming it as a videogame seems like something which would be more appealing to a middle eastern terror group, rather than a ‘white nationalist’ group, regardless of the ‘evidence’ and or ‘reasons’ which say otherwise from him.

You kinda have to look at the whole thing through the lens of a terror group who most likely recruited this one crazy white guy. If you’re the terror group, what do you do with this guy? You have a white guy whose insane enough to go on a terror rampage for you, so you have to utilize this guy in some way. He’s a white guy, so you use that to your advantage, and from there you can fabricate a story about this white ‘nationalist’ extremist. It sorta seems ‘obvious’ in some ways that if you wanna use this white guy you use it in a way to bring about more terror; i.e. you provoke other terror extremists. This guy would’ve killed anyone, you think it matters to him? I don’t think it does. He purposefully targeted (by I’m assuming a group telling him to) muslims who were ‘diverse’, which was most likely an attempt to illicit other Islamic terrorists to carry out revenge terror attacks. Europe and the U.K. should be on high alert. If any revenge terror is going to happen, its probably going to be there I would think.

Worth mentioning again is the notion stated above how this guy is ‘acting’ like a white nationalist, but is also using old jargon and slang from several years ago. The ‘degenerates’ who he’s going to kill etc. Degenerates being an outdated reference to Cultural Marxism in the United States, which I suppose could be geared towards Muslim ‘invaders’ in Europe, but that seems unlikely. Bascially the language doesn’t add up to the narrative story being presented; i.e. ‘white nationalist’ kills ‘muslim invaders’. The reason it doesn’t completely add up is probably cuse the terror group involved has been grooming this nutcase white guy for a while and their story is an old one meant entirely to provoke other Muslim extremists into action and carry out other acts of terror as ‘revenge’.

Islamic Terror
Guest
Islamic Terror
Offline

I guess I fail to see the Right Wing terror at play here. Ok so he killed muslims and he said he didn’t like them cuse they were invaders – fine – so be it, but his narrative is more or less meaningless. He still killed 50 people, does it really matter his motives unless he’s with a group whose targeting the same? His rhetoric is irrelevant to the discussion unless there’s ore people like him – which there were right? Weren’t there other people who were arrested?

What’s misleading about the hwole thing is the media wanting to run with this guys motives, who gives a shit what his motives are unless there’s more people exactly like him, and that’s the ‘narrative’ being put on display, that there’s other white right wing nationalists ready to do the same thing, but my point is that terrorists don’t really have their heads straight to begin with, you can brainwash a terrorist to kill whoever for whatever you like, how he individually justified what he’s doing is irrelevant unless like I said there’s others who plan on doing the same thing. It could easily be just like what he said in that he just doesn’t like muslims or whatever, but coherence or consistency with past right wing terror groups this doesn’t seem to fall in line with certain ideological traits.

Then again, I dunno, this is all speculation, I just fail to see the right wing agenda at play. His ‘story’ or what I’ve read of it, seems inconsistent with any real right wing radicals as far as I can tell.I mean I dunno, it could be just as simple as he’s psycho and following through with his psycho plan and got some other psycho’s to tag along. It’s tough to say honestly, I just think the whole narrative seems contrary to actual right wing terror attacks. Who knows. I don’t really care all that much. S

ad what happened to these people. I dunno if there’s really any preventative measures you can take to stop this stuff other than shutting down all social media which I don’t see happening, but right wingers are gunna get shut down left and right, I don’t really watch Owen Benjamin but the fact they demonetized him says a lot. I think the political Left think tank can’t stand the idea that right wing people make money using their platforms. I actually stumbled upon his live stream the other day, he had like a solid 3,000+ people watching and I think it was overwhelming for him honestly, he said something like, “This doesn’t have to BE ANYTHING, it just is what it is.” or something along those lines, so I think he was getting pretty good revenue coming down the pipeline. I don’t have a problem with the guy, but not sure what YouTubes reasons were.

Anyways, weird time to be living in. I think taking political sides with terrorism is a receipt for disaster, and so regardless of any terrorists motives, unless there’s literally more of them (i.e. its an actual group or something) I think the discussion of terrorism should be reframed completely in the media. Like the media does a poor job of discussing this stuff. Not much else to say bout it.

William Rubin
Member
Member
William Rubin
Offline

Hey Anders, What up “Fagget”!
Nice work trying to deflect blame from a perpetrator of an actual crime, to someone who has never advocated violence, let alone mass murder. You should be ashamed of your own behaviour. Continue your virtue signalling if that that comforts you, but it won’t improve anything.

Smarty
Guest
Smarty
Offline

Oops, hit the upvote by accident.
Don’t agree with this comment in any way.

Jed E Mask
Guest
Jed E Mask
Offline

Smh… “I was told you’re a neatness-freak”.

Seems to me Mr. Burt started this whole mess whereas he could of stayed quite and let Mr. Mark continue to speak with Mr. Leno.

I can’t believe so many guys on here side with Mr. Burt, he doesn’t strike me as particularly “alpha” in behavior or response. He should of just kept his cool and been quiet and laid back in this scene.

Then when Mr. Mark later replies “I’m still married by the way” is how Mr. Mark got back at Mr. Burt for “pestering him” earlier.

Mr. Mark wasn’t saying anything negative to Mr. Burt UNTIL Mr. Burt went down that road wanting “attention” from Mr. Mark. Pretty beta if you ask me.

Also, yeah, at 1:50 in the clip just proves my point by how pathetic Mr. Burt responded: you don’t have to pour water on a man just because you got “offended” by his (truthful?) personal remark you took personally. That to me just shows Mr. Burt lost his frame and was so “offended” he had to retaliate in poor taste.

A much more effective, dignified and respectful alpha move in this case would have been to just play it off and even “agree” like “Yeah, I’ll give you that one Mr. Mark” and may it more “light-hearted, humorous and good-natured” and Mr. Mark may have had to “backtrack his previous remark” and both men could have kept good, positive, friendly social harmony on the set going and amongst the audience.

So even though Mr. Burt may have “figurately” been the more “alpha” man, he lost his frame by having to go so “dirty” so quick over such a petty insult he took personal from the “beta” Mr. Mark whom he previously initiated.

At 1:53 when Mr. Mark planned to retaliate back by throwing a glass of water back at Mr. Burt his only mistake is that he HESITATED and didn’t really want to escalate to the “physical fight level” because he just didn’t really want to fight Mr. Burt.

Had that been me though I probably would’ve retaliated back if some man poured water on me like that in public and NOT HESITATE when I thought to counter.

With Mr. Mark he was still in “hesitant-mode”: should I attack back or not and he was so obvious with his “plan” to throw water back on Mr. Burt, Mr. Burt and the audience before saw it coming so Mr. Mark just ruined his suprise element of attack because “we could see Mr. Mark was going to respond like he did”.

Mr. Burt saw what was coming and since he didn’t make no hesitation already swiped the glass of water back at Mr. Mark, which I understand why he did it but it was really a “jerk move” on Mr. Burt’s part on the FIRST PLACE to attack someone publicly by throwing water on them unwarranted without warning.

You do that to someone else in public and don’t expect them to be “so kind” in return.

Only because I’m a Christian and I know Jesus Christ, and am supposed to love and care for people I “let a lot of things slide” from people because it’s more “kinder” that way even though they don’t deserve.

I don’t always have to do it but it’s what Lord Jesus would have me do.

If it was just me being me without taking God into the equation; people should think twice before attacking me; I’ll probably respond back in my own way and they better be careful for their own sakes.

But every “petty little” thing isn’t worth fighting over, so an alpha or anyone should be the “better person” and overlook some taunts people do.

I don’t even want to say it but the more I look at that clip the more a d-bag and jerk Mr. Burt Reynolds come off especially with the “hand pat” at 2:34 is just being a rude, condescending a-hole. NOT ALPHA at all.

I actually sympathize with Mr. Mark throughout the whole vid even if the guy was “beta” he didn’t do anything to be mistreated like that by Mr. Burt.

Burt was just acting like an a-hole alpha-wannabe jerk having to “tear down another man” to “look tough” himself.

Any real alpha or “real man” would see through his farce like it actually is.

A real cool Alpha would’ve been cool, kind and actually good fun company to be around because he’s got great social charisma and doesn’t have to be rude and condescending to “look powerful”.

That’s all that Mr. Burt did in this particular vid scene that made him look like a butthole on national TV and made me lose respect for him (and I don’t even know the man).

I don’t know nothing about Mr. Mark either except he came across as “beta” but not a full-fledge jerk like how Mr. Burt was acting. That wasn’t alpha; it was pure a-hole behavior if you ask me.

Jed E Mask
Guest
Jed E Mask
Offline

Also at 3:04 of everything leading up to that point Mr. Burt deserved that in my opinion: he was being enough of a jerk throughout the whole segment he got a taste of his own medicine from Mr. Mark.

And though Mr. Mark came across as a “pesty Beta” really because he reacted back at Mr. Burt overall Mr. Mark was the real problem there.

He Mr. Burt was just played a more “friendlier façade” his whole charade with Mr. Mark could have been avoided… Since he was the more “dominant man” in the situation.

I have more respect for Mr. Mark here despite his awkward Beta moments throughout; he meant good just didn’t know how to communicate his good intentions well.

Mr. Burt should’ve behaved more politely.

I don’t see no real “alpha behavior” here besides only the talk show host Mr. Leno came across as more “alpha” then either Mr. Burt or Mr. Mark lol.

Not the best example for “alpha behavior” in my opinion but nonetheless a good yet sad example of the social dynamics of dominant masculine frame in a social situation.

Really pretty much the whole clip escalated BECAUSE OF MR. BURT: if he just kept his cool and was mainly laidback none of the crap would of happened like it did…

~ Bro. Jed

Zarathoustra
Guest
Zarathoustra
Offline

That’s one way to look at it, sure.

But you could also consider that Marc, more used to being the “funny guy”, confronted to a physically towering Burt Reynolds, famous for his “hard ass” characters, acting somewhat erratically and agressively (alcohol?), actually stood his ground and didn’t let it go. He picked up the gauntlet, and although it was akward at times, he doesn’t come out as the “loser” of that odd interaction.

Also, funny enough, everybody think they’re an “alpha” or “redpiller”. I’ve never met anyone yet saying “I’m beta” or “blue pill”.

Path
Guest
Path
Offline

Has no one mentioned yet that this might be scripted? How do you know that these people weren’t just trying to entertain an audience?

Chet
Guest
Chet
Offline

They literally had pies ready for them. This was completely scripted..

Cityfox
Member
Cityfox
Offline

This reminded me of the similar scenario between actor Oliver Reed and actress Shelley Winters. Not sure if these jesters of the system set up this confrontation, but Reed definitely displays more ‘alpha’ qualities than Burt Reynolds here. Prepare for hilarity:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpscJe4L9Do

roger
Guest
roger
Offline

Reynolds obviously has the alpha physical attributes. I wonder if a physically lesser man who dumped water on someone the way he did would just be seen as a weak beta lashing out. In other words, looks wins.

Bobby
Guest
Bobby
Offline

The thing about being a famous celeb: Even if one is down-and-out, fame still enables one to stay in the game in which something else equally lucrative will come along. In the case of Reynolds, yes his marriage was done, and his career waning, but it was only a matter of time before it would pick up again, making tons of money and getting women – all due to fame.

There are exceptions of course, like if the celeb goes completely bonkers and can no longer function in society, or in the case of most recent times a celeb says or does something that the current Zeitgeist deems uber politically correct, but for the most part, those who are famous have a stronger staying power.

...
Guest
...
Offline

99% of comments are from autistic kids trying to prove they have another view on it. F. off kids, if someone wants to tell you a story to pass you some life-knowledge, instead of trying to play the smart guy, be humble to learn from the story instead. If everyone here thinks they know all about relationships already, why the heck you come here in the first place?

Fokker
Guest
Fokker
Offline
Skeptic of roosh
Guest
Skeptic of roosh
Offline

Who the hell is Roosh to judge guys for being “alpha” or “beta”? Roosh sure looked pretty beta when being confronted by femicunts in Canada some years ago. He then acted like a whiny little bitch when amazon banned his books. Hey, Roosh, if you are going to take pride in being a truth teller, than don’t whine about the consequences. You’re just one big waling contradiction.

William Rubin
Member
Member
William Rubin
Offline

You, Sir or Madam are a massive fag!

Anti-Gnostic
Guest
Anti-Gnostic
Offline

Look in the mirror first.

Skeptic of roosh
Guest
Skeptic of roosh
Offline

I’m not used to this comment system. Therefore, I’m not sure if you are responding to me or not. If you are, see my comment above in response to William Rubin.

Skeptic of roosh
Guest
Skeptic of roosh
Offline

Nope, I like women and I actually agree with Roosh about “butt sex” I’m repulsed by sticking my dick in anyone’s ass, man or woman. But, even if was the biggest flaming faggot in the world, doesn’t mean my previous statement is untrue. Truth is truth no matter who says it. Is your response from the “alpha male way to respond to arguments” method. Are actual logic, facts, and arguments “beta, bruh”? Are those not “maintaining frame”?

Roosh says one thing but does another constantly. Did the specific incidents that I mention not happen? His own life contradicts his message. I could get more specific, if you want. What amuses me is his whining about what amazon did to him. He claims to be a proud truthteller and implies that he’s bold and brave enough to pay the consequences, then he goes and whines like a little bitch because Amazon won’t sell his books and whines about censorship. Hello, Roosh! No one is preventing you from selling your books on your own, which you are now doing. No one is entitled to make money from selling books on amazon.

In my world, there are no sacred cows, and that includes Roosh and his cult, to which you apparently belong. Feel free to call me names, but that doesn’t dismiss reality.

Diogene
Guest
Diogene
Offline

a remarkable analysis. I particularly liked this thought: ”It’s not wise to enter any confrontation unless you’re prepared to go all the way”.

There’s another problem, though, and a very insidious one: who’s more ‘alpha’, and who’s CRAZIER. I, for example, although have good physique, height, etc, don’t seem too alpha, at least, well, I don’t look like a hustler or something. In most social situations, I don’t do well at all. Had I been in Marc’s stead, I would have been trembling with rage and I would have been unable to even speak. I would have probably left the show. There’s a problem, though: I never forget anything, good and bad. Burt would have seen me after the show. I am not evil or anything, but people who went too far with me in the past, in the end regretted it. I must say, though, I am very different from Marc. I am not fake like him. His fakery is an impressive skill to have, though. But I don’t have that. I will show you my real feelings. I guess I am not ‘alpha’ but I am not ‘beta’ either. In my opinion, it’s always a mistake to underestimate other people, and only stupid people judge people by their appeareance, which can be misleading. I am not saying Roosh did that, at all….his insight is impressive too, he knows his stuff. I am just saying, better not go around being ‘alpha’, because there’s ALWAYS someone crazier than you. Even ‘beta’ people can become vicious. I have let many people get away with it, and the ones who did not, in the end regretted it. I either hit them hard or ruined their property. They never fucked with me again. I guess I only appeared ‘beta’ to them, but was I ? In this day and age is better to leave people alone and to be respectful regardless. Up to a reasonable point, of course.

NYC
Guest
NYC
Offline

Great article.

What would you recommend as a way to build that “true” confidence?

I have been able to have that confident persona in expect scenarios, but still seem to struggle , no matter how much “self-improvement” I do, with the unexpected scenarios.

That would be a solid article, or better yet, if the article exists, it’d be great if you could point me in that direction.

Justin X. Cuck
Guest
Justin X. Cuck
Offline

I would have assumed the whole thing was staged. It showcases Mark’s style of comedy and Burt probably would have gone along with it. The buzz the next morning would have helped both celebrities. The producers just happened to have cream pies prepared? Really? If there was some actual serious history between two guests, would you book them on the same show and would they both agree to appear together? Why wasn’t Leno more rattled?
And yet, according to media accounts, the confrontation was very real.
Maybe I tend to overthink situations, or I really don’t know what to believe any more from the media.
Roosh’s analysis is valid in any case.

Diogenes
Guest
Diogenes
Offline

actually, I disagree…..that Marc guy is not a ‘beta’. Maybe that’s what he SEEMS. His composure was actually very impressive, and I think even that asshole Reynolds noted it.

Diogenes
Guest
Diogenes
Offline

and he still got his revenge, and Reynolds looked for the asshole he is. Truly the meaning of the saying: ‘what goes around, comes around’.

wpuser11114
Member
wpuser11114
Offline

As others pointed out, Burt Reynolds is not the alpha here – he’s the socially clueless raging alcoholic, instead. If you’re a celebrity, you don’t go to these nighttime entertainment shows to act super alpha and to dominate some other celebrity sitting next to you. You go these shows to make lame jokes, engage in light, inane banter, all in an effort to promote yourself.

DDDDuane
Member
New Member
DDDDuane
Offline

Possibly fake…. with the cream pies out so fast…..