Beta Imagination

When I was young, a simple meeting with a cute girl would fill my head with romantic notions. Back then I really liked the beach, so I’d imagine long walks with her while holding hands. There would be passionate kissing on the sand followed by gentle lovemaking with slow, purposeful thrusts. Another fantasy would be something simple like going to the movies, our hands interlocked, her head leaning against a shoulder which had yet to see the inside of a gym.

These fantasies diminished after I started getting laid. After all, it doesn’t make much sense to imagine a romantic walk when your penis has already walked through her vagina. Instead, I’d imagine more fucking in scenes inspired mostly by porn, with all the nasty things we’ve yet to do.

More time went on and even those fantasies diminished. I began simply replaying sex scenes I already had with her, as if I was reviewing a tape. There was nothing new to these fantasies—they were simple memories that flashed before me when my brain wanted to think about sex.

I didn’t mind the change from romantic fantasizing to replaying sexual memories because the former caused me to put girls on a pedestal. This is especially damaging to your game if you’ve yet to have sex with the girl you’re fantasizing about, because through ensuing actions directed by your subconscious, she will sense that you value her more than she values you.

Recently I was walking through the park when I spotted a girl watching a chess match. This immediately caught my eye and I intersected her to start a conversation. She had a personality type and appearance that I’ve received much pleasure from in the past. She was on her way to meet her boyfriend but I weaseled her number and then a date that ended with only cheek kisses. She was as close to my ideal girl as you can get.

When I went to bed on the night of our date, I made the decision to fantasize about her, for old time’s sake. I wanted to put her on a pedestal. I wanted to care and feel emotional desire. I tried to resurrect my beach fantasy, but it played only for a few seconds. I couldn’t even start a movie date fantasy. I then tried to imagine making love to her, but my brain refused to construct anything, and I began to feel silly. I stopped trying.

Different types of thoughts came into my head instead. What is the percent chance she will cheat on her man? What did her answers to my personal questions signify? What type of date should I try for next? What is her favorite type of liquor? What excuse should I use when she declines the first invitation to come to my apartment? Instead of treating her as a dream girl, my mind saw her as a widget in a factory assembly line, dutifully reminding me of the steps needed to box her up.

I wondered if I should celebrate or regret the fact that I can no longer think of a girl in emotional terms before sex. I could renounce the game and all my bangs but it still wouldn’t bring back the old me. At the same time experience gives you a new ability, it also takes one away, and what you lose you may never get back. I certainly prefer my current self to the one of old, but I wish twelve years ago I had someone to talk to who had already lived the choice that I was about to make.

Read Next: The Dark Side Of Game

Related Posts For You

newest oldest most voted
C.J.
Guest
C.J.
Offline

Great insight as usual, Roosh

Ruxman
Guest
Ruxman
Offline

Alpha persona had a similar post a few weeks back, only it was highlighting the beta in the hero fantasy, where you rescue a girl from danger and she has sex with you.
I recall imagining both.

Omega
Guest
Omega
Offline

You should regret the fact that you can no longer think – you are so very nearly retarded. But that would be an insult to the retard, as they have no control of their identity, you do, and my oh my, what a piece of shit you are. You understand nothing,

JL02
Guest
JL02
Offline

“my mind saw her as a widget in a factory assembly line, dutifully reminding me of the steps needed to box her up.”

I agree with you and Heartiste et al. that society is going down the toilet and about how much damage feminism has done.

But there is a major problem on the opposite end, which is nihilism and the absence of love. I don’t think that is how we are supposed to live either. This is sterile and empty. The Golden Rule is very simple but I think an insightful roadmap to life: how are we supposed to live? Giving of yourself is frightening but also rewarding and fulfilling. It is our evolutionary imperative….a fertility to continue the species.

That doesn’t mean modern women are any great prize, only that men and women can be complimentary, helping each other, with a child as a product of self-giving love. These women exist.

Mike
Guest
Mike
Offline

Omega has revealed himself as a frutrated and delusionl blue-piller who doesn’t understand the reality of women and their true behavior.

I completely stopped believing in pre-sex romance. I used to get friend-zoned alot now I don’t become friends with attractive girls.

I don’t see attractive women as people anymore.

Omegalol
Guest
Omegalol
Offline

^^ @omega lol

Tom Dane
Guest
Tom Dane
Offline

Lol at Omega, like a typical feminist he is not able to explain himself, only shaming without reason or logic behind.
And we let them vote..

earl
Guest
earl
Offline

Omega was on the right track until the insult…so I will present it in a way that does not insult Roosh so that he might see.

You have lost a big chunk of your own imagination. The only way to get it back is to have a pure mind again.

Pure mind in the fact that women barely cross it when you are by yourself…and only a little more when they are actually there.

Student001
Guest
Student001
Offline

Roosh, you didn’t have that person 12 years ago, and that can’t be changed.

Many of us are grateful that you became that person and let us know what the journey was like and what it could/would lead to.

As you get older, I could see you writing something like Casanova’s memoirs (it was on Return of Kings recently). Perhaps a summary for posterity of how to be a man in the era 2000-2030.

Andy
Guest
Andy
Offline

Unless you lobotomize yourself you can never go back. To do so would give up the control you have and put leave your dating future in the hands of “fate.”

spandrell
Guest
spandrell
Offline

You lost me in the “purposeful thrusts”

lalala
Guest
lalala
Offline

You are what you eat, so if you have meningless sex and watch porn then you become what you become… If you made meaningful friendships with women with morals and found girlfriends among those… you would probably be a more normal person and possibly happier… being close to females and accepting they are human beings will also lead to understanding their imperfections and “depedestelizing” in a natural way, with time…

earl
Guest
earl
Offline

“Unless you lobotomize yourself you can never go back.”

So lobotomize yourself.

Life was much more fun as a kid.

Tim
Guest
Tim
Offline

I find smoking pot helps me with my slow purposeful thrusts.

Chayne
Guest
Chayne
Offline

I don’t think it could be summed up any better than this:

http://heartiste.wordpress.com/2012/06/07/the-curse-of-the-player/

What starts out as the ultimate quest for love, turns into a voyage tainted by the success of the original plan. The destination is then tainted by the illumination and realization of the things that we had once wished for.

The true player is right now steeped on a plateau, waiting to climb whatever hill may be next. But there is no hill. We remain seated on the edge of said plateau only to enjoy the mental decline of knowing that certain feelings we will never enjoy again.

If an alpha doesn’t cash in his player chips for the ultimate prize, true and unrequited love, he does nothing more than reveal the beta gnawing at his inner core.

Roosh, believe it or not, your next step in this journey is to find a woman you can love.

It may prove more difficult than finding one to bed.

FelixMuntz
Guest
FelixMuntz
Offline

Certainly have experienced the same pattern of development myself, but was hoping for more of a dissection of the “Beta Imagination” in this article.

Aaron
Guest
Aaron
Offline

I can relate a bit.

For some backround: I have never had any trouble getting girls, but I have a tendency to fall for a certain ‘type’. I had little trouble letting go of, or not giving much of a care about girls outside of this type, and was more than capable of easily pumping and dumping a girl.

Got married young, currently 35, and wound up in a pretty crappy marriage. After lies and a sexless existence I started seeing women on the side. Within the past 2 years I have managed to discreetly get 6 notch counts, most of them more than ONS. Didn’t care about one of them at all really.

The marriage is over now, and then that ‘type’ crosses my path again. This girl isn’t exceptionally hot, she is a hard 6-7 when fixed up. but she has the qualities that do it for me: lite complexion, dark hair, a ass that is nothing less than phenomenal, an actual lady in public and whore in the bedroom. It doesn’t hurt that she is also 25 and takes care of her body.

So after a few months I start getting feelings for her, the first time I had developed actual feelings in years….as a result I found myself completely lose my frame…..thinking “she is special”…”she’s not like that”…etc. Completely shifted from “I am the prize” to “she is amazing”…and I went embarrassingly Beta….way to Beta…the worst thing about it is after 3 years in the manosphere (reader), I knew better.

It didn’t take long, but its just about done now. We haven’t fucked in two weeks, and we barely text (our main form of communication). She says that she is worried about getting this serious with a guy whose divorce isn’t final, but I know better.

So I guess if there is anything other than a cautionary tale in this, there would be the question…how do I kill that part of me? This woman was an excellent girlfriend. Cooked for me when I went over there, always made sure I was comfortable, definitely gf material…but its done now.

The other place where I fucked up….I stopped spinning plates (Rollo)……I had 2 others on the side, but severed ties when I started getting all Beta retard.

The realist
Guest
The realist
Offline

In your posts you frequently sound bitter towards women and relationships and I suspect it is because you secretly want a woman that is both attractive and interesting but can’t make that happen so instead of admitting your shortcomings and improving you write it off as a beta endeavor. There is an incredibly small supply of women that are both attractive and interesting and yet a bigger pool of qualified men vying for them. In such a climate, the one thing that is certain is that these prized women don’t settle for marginally interesting and average looking drifters regardless of how “tight” their game might be.

that rashti girl
Guest
that rashti girl
Offline

between alpha and beta…is there no third way?

EarthlyEros
Guest
EarthlyEros
Offline

Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
Exodus 20:4-6

Blessed are the pure at heart for they will see God.
Matthew 5:8

Oneitis, pedestalization, porn and obsession with sex all fall into Idolatry. Just saying it’s good advice from the man upstairs, could even save your life. The Bible is number one on The Great Books for Men List zllzllzllzllzzzz, lately it’s starting to make a whole lot of sense to me.

Hell fire will make the troubles and tribulations of this world look and feel like a short champagne and ice cream picnic.

Peace Rooshy baby, just adding a little helpful advice; take it with a grain of salt if you like, but I think one day before it’s too late you’ll finally come around to realizing the truth.

arafat scarf
Guest
arafat scarf
Offline

Well written. The necessity of adopting a clinical approach is a consequence of the deal we made with the devil- the Faustian bargain for acquiring the ability to fuck prettier girls.

This game takes a lot out of you.

Anonymous
Guest
Anonymous
Offline

I’d like to make a counter-intuitive point: the state in which you are now is actually better than your old “beta” self, even for the purpose of getting a fulfilling emotional relationship. Think about it – fantasizing about a girl you don’t really know fitting into your “girlfriend mold” is actually viewing her a generic girl just the same as using her as a sex object – in neither case are her personal characteristics a factor. But now, with this new girl, you’re well aware of the fact that you don’t actually know her, refuse to simply place her into a generic context, instead focusing on trying to figure out what she’s like and interacting with her further as a prerequisite for anything else. I’d argue that not being able to think of a girl who’s basically a total stranger in emotional terms is something that you should feel good about, not regret. She first has to earn it……

Spanish guy
Guest
Spanish guy
Offline

Hi, Roosh: Have you thought about publishing a spanish edition of “Bang”?

[Roosh: No. I get way more traffic from Portuguese speakers than Spanish.]

Ed Cefala
Guest
Ed Cefala
Offline

I had a very good mentor who believed in Jesus and the Devil both as important and necessary. He recommended church and bible, thought prayer was one of the most beautiful acts man has created and was a better, balanced player for it.

The old religions that aren’t pacifist simplifications, the old multifacted, multilayered, the old, I can’t emphasize that enough. Solomon (the once borderline erotic poet) wrote which three books?
Why those three, why at those stages of his life?

Very few are as huge as Solomon was, and/ or is and/ or shall be.

muah
Guest
muah
Offline

“the Faustian bargain for acquiring the ability to fuck prettier girls.”

Heartiste had a comment on this track recently, ‘If you can’t look into the abyss without losing all hope, don’t look ‘

Chris J.
Guest
Chris J.
Offline

Those images, those fantasies are put into peoples heads by marketing departments and silly poets. They never have been reality. You’ve lost nothing.

Realist
Guest
Realist
Offline

It’s amazing how many commentators still haven’t quite digested the red pill… Truly, you are kidding yourselves if you think that the all Roosh (or anyone else) has to do is find “a woman you can love”. Love does not exist. You know what love is? Lust plus insecurity (or fear of not finding another). A feeling caused by chemical and hormonal changes that had some sort of reproductive value during the course of our evolution. The minute (no- the second!!) a woman knows you love her, her hypergamous instincts will kick in. It won’t even be conscious, it will just be a nagging feeling of doubt causing to her think “maybe there’s someone better around the corner”.. If you want happiness. If you want to evolve as a human being, look within yourself. Do not look to a woman (or anyone else for that matter) to complete your life.

Thetruthhurts
Guest

Interesting observation. As always health moves from dependence, independence, to interdependence. At some point meaning in life involves interdependence. The good thing about roosh is he teaches men to be independent, which a lot of men never achieve.

capitalXD
Guest
capitalXD
Offline

I must be blessed. no matter how many regular bangs I notch, it is my imagination that seems to push me toward my next conquest. I find reality to be repetitive, but my imagination is fresh and consistently original. if I don’t get the bang in 3 dates I don’t go back to the girl but my imagination of what could have been is so vivid that I get almost as much satisfaction from my thought as I do from an actual bang. call it beta or whatever, but from your writings, Roosh, I think you underestimate your imagination. maybe you cannot imagine the movies or beach walks with a girl, but I am betting you can imagine what her poosy is shaped like or other details that most men covet.
you made my life better with your advise and experiences. thanks again Roosh

jurko
Guest
jurko
Offline

Pains of growth. Thanks for sharing.

R. L.
Guest
R. L.
Offline

I know this feeling well, even though I’m still in my early 20s.

I first started ‘hanging’ out with girls when I was 12, in an actual friend capacity – not the emotional tampon nightmare of the friend zone. I got a heavy dose of the proverbial red pill just from being around them, seeing how gross they could be, how unpleasant and cruel. They were always the ones who escalated, with zero effort on my part. Sure it was great to get sex, especially when most of the guy’s didn’t get anything until 17-18. Often after only having a long term relationship girl’s I had long since chucked.

Still, the whole time I was with these girls, I pined for the one miracle chick that I found attractive and would get me; I’m not unique by any means, but it’d have been nice to have someone to talk to about things I have a passion for with trust and intimacy.

By 19 I realized that was not going to happen. Every girl I had taken down in High School had been vapid, uninteresting, at times cruel – in short, impossible to love. I got into a mid tier University (recently graduated out of that feminist asylum, thank Christ) and even there they were all the same. The first month I tried to push the girl’s from my home town out of my head, thinking these women would be different. They weren’t.

The more women I’m with, the more I find their faces, their personalities blur into a kind of amorphous blob of thongs and g-strings and extensions and highlights and lip gloss and yoga pants. I find the same tattoos in the same places. The same overpriced clothes and shoes cluttering up their dirty rooms. The same pop culture interests, the same attitudes. Those same vacant stares into the smartphones screen. Sometimes, dealing with so many of the same type of women, I feel like my soul is devolving.

I sometimes think some great cosmic creator took the female gender, hit ctrl+c for the first one and has been holding down ctrl+v for the rest ever since. I never learned game in a formal way, but having been friends with girls who made no attempt to hide their real natures around me, I’ve always found it easy to get one since I know how their hive mind works. Or maybe I’m good looking; I don’t know I can’t tell if a man is handsome or not. Regardless, I’ve yet to find a woman who hasn’t reacted the same way to my approaches. From sheer emotional burn out I’ve stopped being minimally nice – refusing to answer their texts or calls when I’m not in the mood to bang, not listening to their stupid stories any more – but somehow this just makes things worse. They started showing up at my rez room and apartment.

The fact of the matter is, women are not on the same level as men in any degree. They aren’t subhuman – I’m not misogynist to believe that for a second – but their love, their passion, their personalities and intellect are all well below what I’ve found in even the most mediocre of my fellow man. They’re good at faking those qualities, but they’re not real. At least our forefathers had the logic and rationality to force their women’s true, blank, state into check. Now with no restraints on them we see openly what men throughout history have always known – women are hollow, inside and out. There’s nothing there. The only ones that have been worth knowing have had strong men in their lives for them to emulate.

I get your view about this imposed nihilism on us Roosh. It’s gratifying to know that, yes, you can judge a book by a cover, that your views are right, that you are not harming yourself through living a lie. On the other hand, to know that there is no dream girl out there for us, that there is no one we will ever truly be able to confide in, to trust, to love? That, in a word, sucks.

Heh, funny story; back in High School I went to pick a girl up for our first ‘date’ and somehow wound up talking to her dad for an hour about Stanley Kubrick movies and Afghanistan. The girl and her mom sat beside us on the couches, both with the same sour bitch face, my ‘date’ huffing and puffing until her mom finally dragged her dad off. Then it was back to my parent’s basement, where we endured an awkward half hour of watching Eyes Wide Shut before I got the point and just took her into my room to bang. I wish I could say she had enough dignity to not have want a ‘second’ date, but we got together a whole bunch more before she started dating my buddies brother toward the end of grade 12. Three years later they’re still dating, probably gonna get hitched.

At least she’s somebodies dream girl.

Nomad77
Guest
Nomad77
Offline

The path to happiness is always the Middle Road.

Travesty
Guest
Travesty
Offline

@31 I think you just added another scar to my soul hahah.

Anonymous
Guest
Anonymous
Offline

I cannot even fantasize about sex with a woman I have never had sex with. Did it when I was in high school once and ended up fucking the girl in real life. Needless to say fantasy and reality proved incongruent .

R.L.
Guest
R.L.
Offline

@33

Ha, wasn’t trying to. Don’t let me or my tl:dr rants get ya down; I’m just an internet emo. In person I’m far better at faking positive karma – after all, grumpy men don’t get women.

The sooner us men learn to accept the irrational reality that we young guys – especially the white ones – are despised by the popular Zeitgeist of western society, the sooner we can begin to transcend and mould that reality into something tolerable for us.

It just sucks that some of us; Roosh, myself and many of you likely included, have to deal with the unnecessarily lost generations of women we’d have otherwise married and given good lives to. We’re players because we’ve been forced to be. I’m sure a few of those numerous girls and women have turned into spiteful, where are all the good guy types by now (and more will be doing so as they enter their mid+ 20s), but if any one of them had shown any slight variation of the female hive mind – if any had shown a slight capacity to be genuinely loving, I probably would have went out of my way to try to make something work with them.

The young western man is starving, and the young women have all the bread. Why are they so resentful when a few of us game them into breaking off a slice for us when they otherwise refuse to share it with the nice, polite man begging for a crumb?

kevm3
Guest
kevm3
Offline

White guys aren’t despised by society. It’s men in general. More than anything, white guys are having the feminism bomb dropped on them now that was dropped on the black community a long time ago and are finally getting to take a look from the other side of the fence… it was field tested first in the black communities and is now brought to the white community. Look at the vast increase in out of wedlock births once welfare was introduced on a significant scale. If you want to see the future of white men, look no further than the black community.

Sharpie
Guest
Sharpie
Offline

This is what I call 1 of the residual effects of Game. But it’s a catch 22 in a sense. To think that this can happen, so we should not bang chicks so wantonly is sort of backwards. Roosh might be loosing his mojo.

Tom Dane
Guest
Tom Dane
Offline

#31 good post.

Quintus Curtius
Guest

I very much like these self-examination pieces, these morsels of soul-searching. If I could be so presumptuous as to analyze and comment, I would say:
Roosh describes his difficulty in “fantasizing” about the object of his desire, this girl. That is, he found it difficult to form romantic thoughts. All that came into his head were the calculus of the bang, and the logistics of the flag.
He regrets that his extensive sexual experience seems to have deadened his romantic senses.
But is this true?
I don’t think his romantic sense has become diminished. What I think is happening is that, with the passage of time and the growth to maturity and experience, the soul no longer is drawn to Ideals that it sees as illusions. The old romantic fantasies no longer attract us, because the fires of youth have cooled somewhat.
Roosh is trying to resurrect the old fantasies, but his rational cerebral cortex won’t have it. The brain rejects it as an illusion. And rightly so. Because to develop, grow, and mature, we have to let go of the Old Idols. We have to let go of the old Ideals.
It’s no good persisting in trying to go back to adolescence. The old Idols no longer have the same shine, lustre, or glimmer as they once did.
We can’t go back. We just can’t. And to persist in trying is just craving, doomed to frustration.
Sometimes, we have to know when to abandon our old Ideals. We have to smash the Old Idols.
Roll them down the steps of our inner Temple, I say.
And get new Idols, better ones, and worship them.

Ternarydaemon
Guest
Ternarydaemon
Offline

Feminism killedthe nice guy.

diseño web
Guest

love these posts where you share wisdom and life experience instead of game tips.

Anonymous
Guest
Anonymous
Offline

Unfortunately, given the behaviour of modern women, men have little choice but to take this path.

Anonymous
Guest
Anonymous
Offline

Unfortunately, given the behaviour of modern women, men have little choice but to take this path.

Igniss
Guest
Igniss
Offline

Very well said.

Perhaps the key is to have good game but keep only to LTRs so that you don’t get desensitized by a large number of partners that makes other girls so predictable? But I suspect the issue isn’t so simple. It’s more about a mental state of innocence lost (at hands of the cruel world) than number of partners.

Ed Cefala
Guest
Ed Cefala
Offline

Some times it’s helping to act is zif I zam from ze udder countrys.

John Rambo
Guest
John Rambo
Offline

“I wondered if I should celebrate or regret the fact that I can no longer think of a girl in emotional terms before sex.”

Congrats, Roosh. You’ve achieved one of the greatest achievements a man can achieve.

We are all douschebags now, LOL.

S & Tired of Roosh
Guest
S & Tired of Roosh
Offline

In a nutshell… you were natural and human when young, and now you are an achiever of attention/salesman, and a true psychopath with a broken switch back to normality. That’s so average…

Moses
Guest
Moses
Offline

I hate to use The Matrix analogy because it’s so cliched. But so appropriate.

“The Red Pill offers the truth, nothing more.”

And

“Ignorance is bliss.”

Moses
Guest
Moses
Offline

Another thought. It is a natural consequence of knowlege that the thing learned about and understood loses some of its romance.

Mark Twain wrote about this after losing his ability to be awed by the majesty of the Mississippi river as a consequence of years as a steamboat pilot.

http://grammar.about.com/od/60essays/a/twowaysessay.htm

Dumbass
Guest
Dumbass
Offline

The deeper into this I get, the better my Catholicism looks. I am becoming convinced that St. Augustine was redpill, and understood the value of the bluepill to society at large, and tried (successfully, for a long time) to force it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augustine_of_Hippo

If I could have met a good girl in high school, me her first, her mine, together forever and ever amen, with assurances of law and society that it would last forever, I would happily trade everything since for it.

Game probably adds more to a man’s contribution to GDP than monogamous marriage, in the same way that single women/moms spend more and produce more tax revenue than married women.