The beef between myself and MRA’s go back a long way. They have been the first to shame game tactics as “manipulation” while I repeatedly criticized them for being more focused on begging authority figures for rights and benefits instead of adjusting to modern-day realities by taking on the path of self-improvement. At the same time, they do understand the problems that are posed by feminism, so we’re not polar opposites on the ideological spectrum.
Last week I did a friendly video chat with prominent men’s rights activist Karen Straughan, who has perhaps done more than anyone in the movement to publicize men’s rights issues. Here’s the video recording:
While I don’t think their cause should be merged with ours, I’m failing to see the need for us to attack each other out of petty differences or boredom. For this year I would like to establish common ground with the men’s rights movement and maintain a civil dialogue, though I don’t see myself using their methods of petitioning the state for changes or adopting the tactic of painting men as victims who desperately need government help. We will likely never be best friends, but I hope at least we won’t be bitter enemies.
Yes it is, otherwise we let the global elite win vis-a-vis divide and conquer
Godamit switch over to the dailystormer.com now doit godamit
“At every turn, the synthetic culture of Empire implores us to throw our hearts and minds into unconscious polarization. It wants us to radicalize ourselves to either patriot or terrorist, believer or atheist, white or black, liberal or conservative, strong or weak, and then embark on an endless crusade to reform, condemn, or destroy the other side. This one-way polarization renders all participants impotent, regardless of which side they pick. This subtle but devastating trick deactivates our will and we automatically forfeit our capacity to rule ourselves. Lost in unconscious polarization, we serve Empire.”
– Neil Kramer
The Fire of Passion what seperates moderates from fanatics. I find the paralyzing indecision of moderates far more malable tool of the state.
You can still be passionate about your individual path and efforts. Whatever you do, do it 110%. But the above quote references things of a political nature. Anyone with half a brain knows that divide and conquer is the game plan of the global elite.
Well written that Neil is
Yeah he’s really got some fantastic, mystical food for thought
Gotdam im geete booored. Jewhunting is sooooooooo boooring here. visit the dailystormer.com and quit the fucking sandnigger
I miss the manosphere circa 2009 before everybody started flinging poo over minor ideological differences. Then you had MRA blogs like the Spearhead which had a major overlap in users with Heartiste, etc.
Heartiste instigated it. I remember that because Roissey was talking about feminists one minute and attacking us next. We didn’t do anything to the PUA’s.
The Spearhead was fun.
I see little wrong here for now. Spreading ourselves too thin fighting among ourselves is only playing into the hands of the SJW’s, Femmies & their handlers.
Never believed in the MRA approach of appealing to authority to fix things. It relies on pinning hopes on an honor system that has proven to be corrupt & toxic for men.
But a sit down with all the capos? Sure. This is an enemy of my enemy sort of thing. Good video!
I see it as identical to the bun fights between protestant denominations. The basic ideology is shared; what to do with it is fought over.
I enjoy some MRA writings, but sometimes it is too whiny. Not what I would seek to make of myself.
We need to use a broad front strategy. You may dislike the other guy, but in the interests of the movement as a whole you set aside your disputes with each other and point your guns at the shared enemy. This is how the left has won its victories.
Excellent point.
The only hiccup I can think of is AVFM getting mad at the AltRight, and associating you with them (and you are, loosely).
Because Dean thinks Cologne was made up by and large.
I dont know if AVFM or Dean matter though.
AVFM doesn’t speak for all MRA’s.
I know. Didn’t mean I to imply it did
This is like how conservatives are stupid for hating libertarians. What they both desire are about 80-90% the same. Who cares if a libertarian wants some drugs to be legal and back benches the moral issues that conservatives care so much about. They just don’t want the morality police coming to get them when they light up a joint. I’m fine with that. They are with conservatives more the liberals on just about everything. The rest of the stuff there care about is of little consequence to the mainstream. As long as they believe in the free market, individual liberty, gun rights, and care something about immigration (I loathe open border libertarians) then I am fine having them in my ranks. Same guys for MRA people. I think the whole whining which seems to pervade the movement is childish and same with the MGTOW (don’t want to marry or have kids fine by me just don’t expect me to care about you when you are older with no children complaining about how society has left you behind). We agree on much more then what we disagree on. Let’s make nice and work on smoothing out the edges of the 20% we don’t agree on.
“This is like how conservatives are stupid for hating libertarians. What
they both desire are about 80-90% the same. Who cares if a libertarian
wants some drugs to be legal and back benches the moral issues that
conservatives care so much about. They just don’t want the morality
police coming to get them when they light up a joint. I’m fine with
that. They are with conservatives more the liberals on just about
everything. The rest of the stuff there care about is of little
consequence to the mainstream. As long as they believe in the free
market, individual liberty, gun rights, and care something about
immigration”
Libertarians disagree on 90% of the important stuff which they consider mere “moral issues” (baby murder, sodomy, etc.). That they support gun rights and a free market just means they’re not complete fools. They don’t understand that a civilization needs monarchy, theocracy, and patriarchy or it goes insane and commits suicide.
Umm you are talking end game man. We are hardly there.
Monarchy? Like Britain? No. Theocracy? Like Iran? Hell no.
Roosh, it seems you’ve found your wife. There’s chemistry between you two.
The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
Exactly. That is why we working together we can accomplish great things.
We will.
For the record, I didn’t know the difference between MRA and ROK until someone explained it to me. Even after reading here for several months. I think it’s silly to fight over such minor squabbles.
A day in the life of a real feminist:
That was fucking hilarious. That must be a joke.
She looks like a female equivalent of a white knight saving men.
She is a mother of men, ridiculously intelligent and well read. Mothers love their sons and she is smart enough to see that society wants to hold her boys down. Beware of a mamma bear
She is a friend, that’s it. Stop your pussy worship which turned things to shit in the first place.
You are one bitter little idiot.Didn’t your mommy love you enough.
And ain’t you your girlfriend’s malleable pussy, sunshine?
Try English next time buddy. Your insults lack a wee of of punch, when they require translation from the rare dialect of Hillbilly you are trying to speak.
Well, Hillbilly or not, it’s just a correct description of you and everyone understands that. No need to be sophisticated when dismissing the pussy-whipped, eh!
Ok I admit it, its a good thing you sound like an ignoramus. It’s accurate
If she came running up,arms stretched out wide saying “rape me and get it over with” you would see a lot scared motherfuckers too.
It’s true that men have been screwed by the government and feminist agenda but complaining about our situation without fixing or trying to improve our situation should be laughable. Men personally fix their problems. If men have problems then they should do something about it, fix it and take action. Not cry about it online seeking attention and blaming it on the “system” all day and basically being drama prone. That’s such a feminine behavior.
Remember if you don’t like your situation then fix it. Men take actions. Men should NOT need government help. We men should learn to be self-reliant and learn how to tackle on situations. Learn to be self-sufficient and don’t depend on others. Don’t let your situation be controlled by others. Take control of your life.
Like it or not, you support the government with your tax dollars. It’s not necessary to seek government help, but it is necessary to shut down harmful government programs.
^ yes true, we all pay taxes and we are all part of the process that facilitate the government with their agenda.
Avoid paying tax, or go straight to federal prison. I think the options to that is easier to make.
We might as well get something for our tax dollars. We protest unjust misandric laws and seek their repeal.
It is necessary to shut down harmful government programs.
That is exactly what we MRA’s strive to do. Like I said earlier we can work together.
Demanding that government step off and leave us alone is not the same thing as asking government to solve our problems.
Wait. You didn’t define yourself in contrast to the Men’s Rights Activists. Are you the Pick Up Artists movement? Or something more substantial?
Another place to find common ground is Christian Men, which these sites seem to have disagreement.
There can be a truce, but these things are odd in terms of why can’t we have our own ideas and live with that reality.
My platform is neomasculinity:
http://www.rooshv.com/what-is-neomasculinity
http://www.poznaninstitute.org
There’s a great book by Ian Ironwood called “The Manosphere” that describes the various factions.
>Traditional Conservative/Christian men
>MRAs
>Wise Old Men
>Alpha Dads
>PUAs
>MGTOW
Christian guys may not be as friendly to you PUA’s the way us MRA’s are.
If you don’t want to the whole video, listen to the last 10 minutes… great stuff.
I see common ground for the various pro-men groups as well as the parts of the alt-right. The wind is changing, and decadent leftist-poz matriarchy is getting shaky in what was supposed to be the very time of its victory. Yes there are fools who want to keep fighting faction wars, but now is a time where a broad, even if loose, common front can make a real difference.
Roosh, things you have been saying for years are now recognized by many, even by some people who refuse to admit where they got them.
You know well that most of them argue like feminists. If they don’t agree it’s “just because”, no reason.
And if they don’t agree or like an opinion, it must be demonized and shamed. Just like feminists.
So how do you co exist and agree on those terms?
Petitioning the state is necessary. How the fuck else are you supposed tp have a child who isn’t taken from you by gunpoint? Your assets taken from you by gunpoint. It’s always possible to tame a woman especially if she relies on you for support, it’s the family courts that are fucking us over in reproduction. You can’t beat the state if you want to have kids.
If by “truce” you mean “don’t got out of your way to do battle with the enemies of your enemies” than the answer must be yes.
There is too little common ground to think that the bulk of the MRM and ROK readership could be effective as active allies.
BUT… it is also unquestionably a foolish strategy to focus on doing battle with anyone who is currently out of favor with the ruling cultural establishment if you also find yourself in that category, whether as an individual or a member of a group with such a designation.
I see Roosh as the next Paul Elam. Elam’s only got at most 5 yrs left, a decade, tops. He’s 59 yrs old. That’s not actually old nowadays, but at some point, say maybe 65, people start tuning you out. We’re a youth obsessed society. So I see a vacuum when Elam leaves and I think Roosh will fill it.
I see the MRM being suckered into a PC arms race with feminists that doesn’t help anyone. Feminists say having sex with drunk women is rape? Well then the same standard should apply to women who have sex with drunk men! Female circumcision is wrong? Then male circumcision is wrong! Feminists shame men who do wrong? Then MRAs should shame women who do wrong! Its a race to the the bottom that helps no one.
But I agree we should work together or at minimum stay out of each others way.
“If you have a country where people are not getting married or having kids,…”
…Then you don’t have a country.
hi
If we say divide to conquer, I would say that associate up lead to win. Group up to attack a common enemy : Feminism !