What’s It Worth?

When Hedonistic, in a recent thread, asked why guys who only want to pump and dump don’t just hire call girls for $400 per hour, it got me wondering just what kind of girl a guy could actually get for $400/hr (No, I don’t need any call girl services, I got a girl who treats me right). I thought I would do a little research and look at some escort sites. I originally planned to make make a quick clever response in that thread, but what I found deserves a thread of its own. I would like to present some of the results of my research.

[First, before some large men dressed in black hunt me down, every girl selling herself on the web states very clearly that she is only selling her time and companionship, and that no sexual services are implied in the rate charged. Any intimate contact is based on the agreement of two consenting adults and is in no way to be expected.]

Having said that, let us review the market for feminine “charm.”

The Data

To spend time with this 23 year old Spanish hottie, Camilla, you must book a two hour appointment for $2,400 and after that initial visit, you may see her for one hour at the rate of $1,200.

camilla2-2600.bmp

To enjoy the companionship of this sultry Russian babe, Anastasia, one hour will cost $350.

anatasia-350.bmp

If you prefer an all-American cutie like Cindy, her time will cost $250 per hour.

cindy-250.bmp

Have yellow fever and seek an exotic Asian like Saki? That will also be $250 per hour.

saki.bmp

If you like your women “thick”, then Dani will offer you a special rate of $200 before 2:00 PM, but it’s back up to $250 after 2:00 PM. (Hey, her time is precious).

dani-200-250.bmp

(no, I am not kidding, I found her out there at those rates).

No discussion of this would be complete without a mention of the high end of the market, for you discriminating gentlemen who seek the finer things in life. Ever want to meet that porn star you found on the internet? Well, one enterprising porn star actually offers men a chance to meet her. She is based in LA but does tours of major cities (she was in DC in early October) and will fly anywhere if travel is covered. Her name is Sarah Blake, she is innocent looking in a “is she really a porn star??” way, and an hour of her time will cost you $1,000 (discounts for multiple hours available).

sarah2.bmp

And finally, there are the New York/Miami/LA models. This one New York agency does not even list their rates online, but says that the cost of an “introduction fee” to meet a real model “has a comma in the figures”. This is Angelina. You can’t see all of her face, but I have a feeling it looks pretty good.

angelina.bmp

The Questions

The pics and rates above forced me to ask myself some questions.

1. There are some really hot women selling themselves. Like “why the fuck aren’t you married to a millionaire?” hot. Why do women who can have any man sell their companionship to many men? Is the money that easy for some women?

2. None of these women look like “the type” to be selling whatever they are selling. It makes me think any decent looking woman, and some not so decent *cough* Dani *cough*, could be doing this. So how many are actually doing this? Were my cute college classmates paying their way through school like this? Are those hotties in the A-crowd clubs blowing off guys who approach because they have four men booked the following day?

3. What is with the pricing for these services?? Dani charges $250 an hour, same as hotties liks Saki and Cindy, but shouldn’t she be paying us? And what’s with Camillia and her $2,400 initial appointment? Yeah, she is cute for sure, but one sees girls of her level out all the time. Maybe she is engaging in luxury pricing – making something seem more valuable by charging an inflated price for it.

4. How many men will look at the pics above and never approach a regular girl again? How many girls will look at the hourly rates above and quit their day jobs tomorrow? How many wives who have “lost their passion” will see the hot young girls available to their husbands and rediscover their libido instantly?

Finally, here’s some math for us guys in relationships. In order to get as much “companionship” from girl at Cindy or Saki’s rates to match what a guy gets from his girlfriend in one year (say 3 per week x 50 weeks = 150 per year), he would need to spend $37,500 over 12 months. At Anastasia’s rates, $52,500. And at Camilla’s, $180,000. Having a girlfriend is more economical.

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Phil
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You might be surprised how many of your classmates may have been doing this.

I had one who was arrested in an escort service sting while we were just out of college, and another who we ran into at a local strip club, serving as an 18 yr old ‘shot girl’.

KassyK
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I am with Phil…had a really hot friend right out of college that was an escort…hot like that Russian chick…and she was making a lot of money. She is royally fucked up in the head now so really–is the money worth it? Nah.

Dirk Diggler
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News Flash: She was already royally fucked up in the head. You just didn’t see it before or she got worse.

hedonistic
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Good post on the economics of female companionship under the cash-for-flesh model. I wonder if this will encourage your male readers to better treat the ordinary women in their lives? I wonder, bemused.

You forgot Jet Set Lara, who charges $10,000 a night to American men. She lives in the UK and will pay her own airfare. If a woman is college educated, multilingual, and sophisticated you’ll pay through the nose for her companionship.

I have a friend who says, “I don’t pay them to come; I pay them to leave.” The fee is just the “price” he pays for not having to invest the time or effort into a relationship. He hits it, he quits it. Is it worth it? To him, I suppose. I guess he assigns a high price to a phone call.

We all pay a “price” for everything. Money is just congealed energy. We all (men AND women) have our perceived “worth,” even if we haven’t put much thought into what our “price” might be. Once I tried to decide how much money it would take for a man to pry my legs open if I did not find him sexually attractive. All I could come up with was, “ew.” However, I enjoy a high income and can afford not to worry about it.

Since men generally would fuck a hole in a tree if they had to, and their price to fuck women is FREE!!!!!! let me turn the question around for a second to help you determine your “price.” If you are a straight man, how much money would it take for you to be willing to take it up the ass from another man? If you can come up with a number, congratulations, you’ve determined your price.
Now imagine yourself living on the street, and you’re hungry. What’s your price NOW?

In LA, you can get a hot chick for $200, because there are so many pretty girls from Iowa who thought they’d be movie stars. Why do women hook? Because they’re BROKE and DESPERATE, and working nights at the Pigglywiggly just doesn’t pay the rent. It’s a rare (extremely rare) woman who actually enjoys the work. Sometimes women do fetishize “stranger sex.” Whatever.

Why don’t more women do it? Because their perception of their worth prices them off the market, and because they have other viable options. How do you assign a price to self respect and bodily integrity? The vast majority of the women in this world will not hook unless they’re desperate to pay the bills. And if you’re a woman who turns up her nose and says “not me, never,” you’ve just never been desperate or broke enough. But for the grace of God.

hedonistic
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Hey, I just realized I have (almost? could it be?) the same bra and panty set worn by the woman in the last photo. Kewl.

lady bizness
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I don’t think that desperate + broke = hooking for all women, or even most, or many women. I’ve been pretty damn broke, as have a few of my female friends, and we did shocking things like: get second and third jobs, cut down on expenses, and accumulate massive credit card debt.

Women who turn to the sex trade usually have two specific issues: history of sexual abuse, and/or drug addiction. In both cases the woman’s self-worth is of minimal importance, so the choice to give it up to any man with a big enough wallet is not so difficult.

Sweatpants
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Camilla charges so much because she attended Sexy University, which as we all know is an extremely prestigious school.

(Who the fuck would wear that top? Seriously.)

Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Lady Biz is correct and many of those glamor girls are going to be this shape eventually…

http://crackwhoreconfessions.com/

KassyK
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Hedon–How about making it for guys to imagine the price of them taking it up the butt by some OTHER angry male that hates men. That would even it up a bit in terms of a lot of what we go through no?

Rough butt sex men? You in?

hedonistic
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Ladybidness: Yes both those things (abuse history, drugs) will often lead to low self-worth, which will translate to a lower “price.” When I’m feeling typically bitter and cynical, I’m suspicious that society deliberately squashes women’s self-worth to ensure a steady stream of women willing to give it up for a handful of bills or a sandwich. On days when I’m feeling more charitable, I figure it’s a subconscious dynamic: Generally, people increase their control over people by narrowing their choices.

(Think about the way elephants are trained: When they are young they are tethered at the ankle so they can’t run away. By the time they are 3 tons and able to break away from the tethers, they are so psyched out that it doesn’t occur to them to run.)

Having the energy, ability and time for that second or third job (been there!), or a credit rating that will allow us to accumulate massive debt (lucky us!), or enough wiggle room in the budget to decrease expenses, are choices that come with a certain amount of privilege. Some women have none of it.

BHR
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BHR
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I’m in Kassy.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Smart writing.

O-face
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Camilla and Angelina can get it….. Can you write that off on your taxes???? I got mucho respect for excorts because at least their trying to full market value. These other brawds out here giving it up for popcorn and “Chronicles of Narnia” dvd are f-ing fools I tell you.

Roissy
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some shrew shrewed:
“If a woman is college educated, multilingual, and sophisticated”

you misspelled ‘hot’.

“pry my legs open”

the words you use to describe wanting sex with a man are very telling.

“Since men generally would fuck a hole in a tree if they had to”

not all men. just the ones you are likely to attract now that the wall is rapidly approaching.

“If you are a straight man, how much money would it take for you to be willing to take it up the ass from another man?”

your analogy is flawed.
poofterism is a biologically grounded orientation with zero history of straight men making money this way.
male-female prostitution is sexual economics purified.

“on the street, and you’re hungry.”

if hunger or poverty or whatever similarly insipid feminist tripe you trot out in service to your ideological deadweight thinking were the primary drivers of persuading girls into a life of whoring, why do the call girls mentioned above continue doing their work when it is plain to see they are enjoying rather luxurious lives and are quite well-fed?

“I have (almost? could it be?) the same bra and panty set ”

this is a good time to remind the “””class””” that you are an aging single mom with a rancid bitter afeminine personality utterly void of inner beauty, so when you do your little sex kitten on the blogwalk thing it’s transparently bullshit.

best,
roissy

did you know those countries which have legal prostitution have a lower incidence of rape?

Daily Misogynist
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I agree with the idea that everyone has a price. And because of that, compounded with hunger and desperation, people will put up with an inordinate amount of shit. (So much for treating women better.) Men will push the limit, and women will let them.

I think women prostitute themselves because even though they have better/safer options, they can make a lot more money hooking than working at a respectable 9 to 5 job. Vegas strippers make upwards of six figures a year. All it costs is your soul.

hedonistic
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Roissy is the one with the flawed logic in that he sees my age/fuckability/personality somehow relevant to this discussion about the flesh trade. BRAIN DAMAGE perhaps?

Anyhoo.

Maybe Roissy never saw this movie:

http://men.style.com/gq/features/slideshow/v/041005BADMOVIES?loop=0&ssType=STANDALONE&event=&designer=&trend=&slideshowId=slideshow24783&iphoto=23&play=false

The character Richard Gere played was straight.

I personally know a straight man who defected to the US when he was in his 20’s and found himself homeless in NYC . . . and . . . fortunately that story has a happy ending (he found a job as a mechanic, went into business for himself and is a millionaire today), but . . . ow.

Why do women continue to hook after they’ve made big bucks in the flesh trade? Many reasons, but the main ones are:

1) they’ve developed a drug or other very expensive habit;
2) they are afraid of explaining “gaps” in their job histories to potential employers; and/or
3) no one wants to hire them into straight jobs because they think sex workers are garbage; and/or
4) they have pimps and they’re scared shitless.

80% of women in the flesh trade want out (yes, psychologists have done surveys). That leaves 20% who “like” their work. Whatever floats their boats I say.

Virgle Kent
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blah blah blah blah,

The pornstar got some camel toe for real for real

Wendy
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wow, this is really interesting. Screw being married and working…I going to do that!

KassyK
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VKent–That humor was so necessary…thanks sugah.

And she does have some camel toe–maybe they teach them that at Sexy University.

O-face
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Anybody got a tax code on this?????? Pimps up Hoes down. Shit, why would a woman work in a frickin office making 30-50 grand a year, living on “Corporate Fair”, when I can make six-figs and give some hellacious “slow neck” to the customers??????????

Roissy
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bitterbot:
you’re using a movie and a personal anecdote as evidence of your contention that your analogy is valid and you expect me to take note of your powers of logic?
you asked above what price men would put on themselves to take it up the ass from another man. you did not ask what price a gigolo would charge to deliver the penetrating insight to a willing (and presumably gay) male john. the two things are entirely different, and goes straight (heh) to my point that there is virtully no historic or sociological evidence of straight men charging money for the privilege of getting ass love from male prostitutes, and that this outcome naturally flows from the obvious biological framework within which we all operate, including your sagging hide.

“Why do women continue to hook after they’ve made big bucks in the flesh trade?”

because the getting is good.
and, oh yeah, they forgot to read your memo that they are tethered elephants and society is narrowing their range of choices.

“80% of women in the flesh trade want out”

and 80% of corporate cogs want out. what’s your point, sparky?

BHR
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BHR
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VK come rest your kola nuts upon my chin and make a cool 5 bucks quick.

Daily Misogynist
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Regarding the men taking it up the ass from Tyrone aspect:

Back in high school, we used to play a game to determine your price. Let’s say someone would pay you 10K to fuck your ass, plus pay for the anal retread. Would you do it? If you’d do it for 10K, you’d probably do it for 5. And hell, if the guys dick wasn’t that big, you’d do it for a thousand bucks.

We got one of our friends to admit that he’d toss someone’s salad for 50 dollars. Everyone is a whore, they just don’t know it yet.

mhm
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These threads are always so entertaining. I consider them a public service.

Anonymous
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Anonymous
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haha!

Roissy
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dani’s pricing her gross flabby ass out of the market. she’d be lucky to give it away for free at a bus depot toilet to an anime fanboy with micropenis and cheesy poofs stuck under his mantit folds.

phi
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Its funny how a entry about what guys are willing to do to hit it and quit it has morphed into what women are willing to put up with.

As for financial matters, I thought this was relevant: Even if she didn’t prostitute herself.
http://www.violentacres.com/archives/32/drastic-measures

not that it matters
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not that it matters
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“Finally, here’s some math for us guys in relationships”

You in a relationship?

Steve Lurkel
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Nice post, Chaco. But I’ve got to wonder what the figures in that last paragraph would be were we in a country where prostitution is legal (with some restrictions)? As it stands, conditions in L’America are ripe for price inflation.

A-nonne
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As usual, Roissy comes with the 4th grade girl-hating bullshit.

Chaco
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Great discussion everyone. I found this topic pretty facinating, I must say.

Not that it matters: yes, I am in a serious relationship. Her actually value in terms of “companionship,” massages, meals cooked, entertainment, friendship, and love provided far exceeds $37,500. Maybe I’ll do a post someday where I try to figure that out.

Jewcano
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So basically women in DC are as overpriced as condos are. No wonder they sit on the market so long.

IQ girl
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You know, there are women professionals who make alot of money. Professionals, not as in escorts or hookers, but smart women like doctors and lawyers and such. We are in 2006, afterall. It is not always about what woman a man can afford. Just a worthless thought on a Friday evening.

Joe T.
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First I think it’s because it’s a myth that these women “can have any man”. Millionaires and billionaires are only a tiny percentage of the population, and when you add in factors like reasonable marriageable age, being straight, and being single, the numbers of available catches for these women get way smaller. Whereas, when you really look at it, hot women like the ones in the pictures (and it’s really debatable how hot some of them are) are a dime a dozen — or at least much more common than the men who would make “natural” catches for them.

Therefore it’s just a matter of numbers and it makes total sense that all these women are selling themselves. They could stop everything and spend 100% of their time trying to bag a millionaire, but that alone doesn’t put food on the table and a roof over their heads TODAY. The most efficient way for most of these (uneducated; non-career) women to make a living, is, unfortunately, being high-priced hookers. Moreover, in the process of selling themselves for lots of money, don’t think they’re not also simultaneously looking to bag a wealthy guy. For these women, this is just an efficient way of meeting a lot of prospects. It just stands to reason.

hedonistic
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Joe T: Depending on where you live, millionaires are also a dime a dozen (they are where I live), but they don’t marry prostitutes. These women can have any of my neighbors for a few hours tops. Only rarely does a call girl experience her happy ending.

But enough about the girls: As Chaco is saying, Wise men eventually figure out that it’s more economical to spend other kinds of energies besides money on appealing, high-quality women: Long-term attention, affection, quality time, yard work, household chores, etc. This is what women think when they imagine “fair trade” anyway, so come on, it won’t kill you.

Wendy
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O-Face, 999999 just nine it out. Believe it or not, prostitutes do do taxes and write off their condoms and blood tests and hooker heels and antibiotic creams and such. Weeeeeee!

mhm
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“As Chaco is saying, Wise men eventually figure out that it’s more economical to spend other kinds of energies besides money on appealing, high-quality women: Long-term attention, affection, quality time, yard work, household chores, etc.”

That actually sounds a lot more expensive than shelling out some cash every once in a while. Most rich men would want both anyway. Kinda like the Madonna/whore dichotomy of Victorian England.

Joe T.
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hedonistic: true, they don’t marry prostitutes, but the question Chaco brought up, and to which I responded, was why any extremely hot female would opt for the hooker lifestyle, not whether mega-rich guys would choose attractive hookers over other equally attractive women.

As regards the neighborhood where you live having a high density of millionaires, maybe they are gravitating towards attractive women like you?

Seriously, you probably live in a very “yuppie” neighborhood, or an old-money neighborhood (I’m guessing Northwest DC?), that brings up another of my longtime bugbears — why (white, professional) DC-area women are so insanely picky about men, and have such bizarrely high, often unattainable standards.

My contention has long been that it’s because DC attracts the “best and the brightest” from all over the country. Consequently, you have far more than the average numbers of Ivy-educated valedictorians who were captain of the football team AND Homecoming King… making for ridiculously tough competition for the rest of us “regular” guys.

Standards, though, are relative to time and place. Women, like bacteria in a petri dish, respond to the stimuli around them. If you take 1,000 of DC’s hottest single women and force them to live in Gooseneck Gulch, KY or Walnut Flats, ID, their standards will eventually drop and before you know it they’ll be shacking up with drooling, hunchbacked guys who got their GEDs from an ad in back of the Old Farmer’s Almanac.

Anonymous
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The extremes belie the reality (at least as I’ve seen it). Some “amateurs” are working a “second” job ..namely, being the mistress/girlfriend and gettting money in return. Consider, if you are in school or in school and working, and a guy will add 300-500 a week to your bank account, that’s your second job. Ethics and morals are fine and dandy like cotton candy if you think there is something wrong with making that trade, if not, bully on people who would point fingers. It may also be that a guy is looking for things (companionship, emotional support, feeling good about himself) that he does not get at home and even if he has to “pay” to get that validation, he may also find a woman who is at least decent enough to hang out with, not to mention, have sex with …

just saying …

hedonistic
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Joe T: Only if those women have been successfully brainwashed into believing they must have a man . . . or die spinster catladies, like somehow that’s a bad thing!

wink

I live in a suburban/exurban neighborhood in NJ dominated by high-profile, high-income professionals (doctors, attorneys, financial types who commute to Philly or NYC) AND old money. I get to DC periodically on business but don’t move in political circles. (The men in my neighborhood aren’t necessarily all ATTRACTIVE, by the way, they’re just . . . men!)

I think the REAL reason people are so unhappy about their romantic choices, besides the obesity epidemic, is too much “reality” TV and too little REALITY. Too many romantic and sexual delusions projected on the hapless folk around us who are just trying to live their lives like normal people. Rich men can just afford the fantasy on a more-or-less hourly basis.

mhm
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“I think the REAL reason people are so unhappy about their romantic choices, besides the obesity epidemic, is too much ?reality? TV and too little REALITY. Too many romantic and sexual delusions projected on the hapless folk around us who are just trying to live their lives like normal people. Rich men can just afford the fantasy on a more-or-less hourly basis.”

Very well said and very true. People are impacted by the images they see in the media and expect that to be their reality. This goes for both men and women. The men’s equivalent of shows like “Grey’s Anatomy” is gonzo porn.

Roissy
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joe t., my russian GF tells me that the homeland is filled to brimming with hot natashyas surrounded by trollish, criminal, drunk and irresponsible russian men. yet, these guys hook up, and fairly regularly. it’s still the alpha drunks that are getting the girls, so the standards are universal, but context matters. An alpha tribal leader bushman may have 20 wives in africa but be hard pressed to get a date in DC. what’s interesting is that the compression and availability of data about men from around the world coupled with relative ease of travel enables these russian hotties to advertise their wares to suitors with much better prospects. what follows are mail order brides. in the same way, men from wealthier countries who cut their teeth dealing with mediocre looking american women with inflated senses of self-worth and entitlement would do well to learn the language of a marginal country and spend a few weeks getting to know the pretty locals. even a green card whore is superior to a bloated ballcutting american wife or a pay as you go prostitute.

Roissy
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“or die spinster catladies, like somehow that’s a bad thing!”

your reckoning is closer than you know.

“The men’s equivalent of shows like ?Grey’s Anatomy? is gonzo porn.”

no.
porn does not manipulate men’s reality; it confirms it.

Joe T.
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Roissy, interesting you brought that up because I’ve been traveling a lot and in July-August I visited Ukraine for 2 weeks to hook up with one of those hot “Natashyas” I met on the Internet. Unfortunately, it didn’t work out as her English was almost nonexistent (it turned out her mom, a college professor, was writing all her emails — not just translating her words but COMPOSING the letters, including pop culture references and dirty jokes!) My mistake was gullibly accepting it all with only one brief telephone conversation to hear her voice. Was she hot? Well, I have a thing for tall girls (I’m 5’8″ and in DC, for me to sleep with, much less date a taller, attractive woman would be absolutely unheard of)… This girl was a 6′ volleyball player. Unfortunately, because of a weird plumbing problem in her apartment (a creaky, high-ceilinged affair I likened to the Addams Family’s house), she rarely bathed (when she did it was by boiling a big pot of water on her stove)… so on top of all the other problems, she had pretty fierce BO. She was a nice girl, but I passed on the sex part.

But Ukraine women are amazing and you can best believe ol’ Joe T.’ll be back to sample more of the wonders of that wonderful country.